The HfP chat thread – Sunday 6th June

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Yuff says:

6 Jun6 June 08:33

Not very often I agree with Tony but even he is saying vaccination should mean something and those vaccinated should have their freedom, those who aren’t tough……..hallelujah………
I do like the bit where the government spokesperson has accused him of receiving leaked info.
Hopefully implemented on June 21st ……..
- Hak says:
  
  6 Jun6 June 09:34
  
  Easy to take such a position if you are older and have been decreed from on high more worthy of a vaccine then a young and healthy person. Less compelling if you are not.
  - Yuff says:
    
    6 Jun6 June 09:37
    
    By next month everyone over 18 will have had the opportunity to be vaccinated. If people choose to not be vaccinated when offered it, then let them deal with restrictions and all those that are vaccinated get on with their daily routine.
    - Tom says:
      
      6 Jun6 June 10:46
      
      Erm, but first dose is meaningless and it will probably be late August/September before even the first people in the last adult age groups in the U.K. are considered fully vaccinated!
      - Andrew says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 13:14
        
        It most certainly isn’t “meaningless”. That’s the kind of nonsense promulgated by hate ridden anti-vaxx extremists.
        
        The first dose gives considerable protection.
        
        Indeed, later in the year the J&J single dose vaccine will be available in the UK.
      - Tom says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 13:46
        
        I mean it’s meaningless for the purposes of a vaccine passport which is the topic in question, not that people shouldn’t get a first dose. No county on the planet is going to roll out a vaccine passport for those partially vaccinated. Thanks for resorting to childish name calling when someone posts something you disagree with, though (to be clear I had my first dose literally the first day it was available for my age group).
    - HAK says:
      
      6 Jun6 June 19:27
      
      Partially vaccinated is not going to cut it for a “Covid passport” given the majority of us need to have two shots.
- Harry T says:
  
  6 Jun6 June 09:41
  
  Made a lot of sense to give vaccines to older people first – they are overwhelmingly more likely to die of covid; this is not an illness that kills young people in a statistically meaningful manner. Plenty of young people have also been vaccinated, if they work in certain professions or have serious underlying health problems. Personally, I would have no issues with only vaccinated people being allowed to travel – don’t the ICU nurses and doctors deserve a nice holiday after working heroically since March 2020 whilst most of the adult british public has had free furlough brunch?
  - Genghis says:
    
    6 Jun6 June 09:49
    
    “ most of the adult british public has had free furlough brunch”
    Not quite. Most still been working hard – including me. https://www.ons.gov.uk/businessindustryandtrade/business/businessservices/articles/comparisonoffurloughedjobsdata/march2020tojanuary2021
    - Harry T says:
      
      6 Jun6 June 09:57
      
      I stand corrected! Thanks for the link.
      
      I don’t think we should prevent vaccinated people from travelling and I do think that some of the frontline healthcare professionals really would benefit from a summer holiday (that doesn’t include me), but I am clearly way off base about how many people have been on furlough. I guess it’s easy to be swayed by the stories we hear about people who’ve had the time of their lives on furlough, when it seems that is a relatively small portion of the population. Just goes to show the power of data vs anecdote.
    - meta says:
      
      6 Jun6 June 10:23
      
      Yes and some people worked hard with reduced salaries (and some still are) because their employers didn’t want to send them on a proper furlough so they can still call them at short notice. And if you didn’t agree to such employment contract alterations then you’d be sacked immediately. Fairness argument wouldn’t stand as they applied it to all employees equally.
      
      Let’s not forget doggy employers as well who misused furlough scheme…
      - meta says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 10:24
        
        To clarify, they worked hard because short notice turned out to be full time.
    - Rob says:
      
      6 Jun6 June 10:37
      
      Numerous press stories that hospitality venues which are open can’t recruit staff because many in the sector are happily sat at home picking up furlough cash as there own existing workplace is still closed and they have no intention of moving, even to a better paid job, if it actually involves doing some work ….
      
      You should take furlough numbers with a pinch of salt though, because – based on a sample of one pub owner I know – there are a lot of fake people on the list.
      - Aston100 says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 10:44
        
        Rob, this is pretty much what I was told by a chain hotel last week when I questioned why they seemed to have few staff but those staff were working seemingly very long hours.
        Apparently a combination of Brexit and Covid have meant they are finding it hard to get the ‘type of worker that is best suited to hospitality’.
      - Lady London says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 10:45
        
        furlough allows you to take a role with another employer actually, interestingly
      - The Savage Squirrel says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 10:56
        
        Do know a few people that have had pretty much a year of double salary via this route.
      - Super Secret Stuff says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 11:12
        
        Re double salary, same. At one point I knew someone who was furloughed from one job, got another job that got furloughed and then picked up a third jobs!
      - Anna says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 12:45
        
        I read in our local paper that just 2 medium sized towns in our country have had £60 million between them in furlough cash. It’s mind-boggling when you start scaling that up for the entire UK.
  - Number9 says:
    
    6 Jun6 June 09:52
    
    Really Harry T entitled or what ! A lot of people have worked through pandemic without looking for praise or reward. Not everyone has sat on their behinds working from home or been on furlough money.
    - Harry T says:
      
      6 Jun6 June 09:58
      
      I’m not a frontline healthcare worker – but I know people who have worked on ICU during this pandemic and I can assure you that no one is more deserving and in need of a restful summer holiday in a nice sunny part of the world. There’s a difference between working hard and going through that kind of experience.
      - Number9 says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 10:07
        
        Stop digging Harry, who are you to decide who’s more deserving. Lots of non medical workers have done their best to keep the country going under trying circumstances. You don’t know their stories or what they have gone through.
      - Andrew says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 10:14
        
        Wow! And I can assure you that working from home this last 15 months has been anything but a piece of cake either! Work has been harder and more complicated than ever and just because I haven’t had to put a tie on and walk 15 minutes to my office each day, doesn’t mean I’ve been kicking back at home. People always seem to think their own personal circumstances are the hardest but we’ve all been through a lot and in different ways – have some compassion.
      - Lord Doncaster says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 10:21
        
        The ability to work at home also means you can wear your PJ’s all day 😏
      - Andrew says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 10:25
        
        Nope, certainly not on the top half of my body when I’m meeting with clients, board members etc all day on Zoom.
      - Anna says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 10:26
        
        I thought you were a hospital doctor, Harry T?
      - Aston100 says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 10:29
        
        Pretty much everyone that I know (that are working from home now) are working more hours than when they were office based.
        I wouldn’t be surprised if this becomes normalised in the future (working longer hours, but from home).
      - Freddy says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 10:31
        
        I know one person who was placed on furlough whilst the company they worked for went down the gutter due to restrictions. Now looking for a job in a decimated industry. Not sure they enjoyed lounging at home
      - Rob says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 10:32
        
        With the good old Holiday Inn Express Bodmin (spend your Cornwall holiday at a motorway service station) now pushing £200 per night in August, your average healthcare worker can’t afford a decent UK holiday this Summer because prices have been jacked up to a level which the wealthiest few hundred thousand people who want a coastal holiday can pay.
        
        This also ignores the fact that I reckon the total capacity of all UK seaside resorts is probably 1-2 million beds at most.
        
        There is, literally, no capacity in the UK for everyone to holiday domestically. If you can’t afford a few hundred pounds per night for a 3-star then you’re stuck, and this is the situation for most NHS staff and care workers.
      - Lord Doncaster says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 10:37
        
        Really Andrew…I would have thought you would have had some posher PJs, with you being a regular shopper at Harrods and Harvey Nics 😂
      - Lady London says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 10:42
        
        I think Harry’s point is that strugglng for weeks on end to keep patients in your care alive with a new overwhelming disease and losing 1 in 5 of them after weeks of acute care with each patient (unusual in ICU), 4 in 5 perhaps surviving but 50% with effects that considerably deteriorate the patient’s life permanently going forward… and ICU swamped with patents like this….Plus knowing that outside the doors of ICU’s and hospitals are patients with other deserving conditions who are deteriorating and suffering because there is no medical capacity to take them… Yes that’s a bit wearing even if it’s a job you’re paid to do. In fact you’d hope those treating you still had a heart and would get stressed by this.
        
        That’s not to say many other jobs and situations are not also as stressful but that’s by no means all.
        
        However Harry T in one or two of your very recent posts a tiny element of ‘entitlement’ has crept in. I don’t mind because I like people to be ‘real’, there is some actual right to that, and I learn much more on here when people reveal things they truthfully think.
      - Andrew says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 10:42
        
        Hahaha. Well of course they are Derek Rose, but even still, I’m not sure I can conduct business with a straight face wearing them.
      - Tom says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 10:51
        
        You literally posted one minute before this post “Just goes to show the power of data vs anecdote”, then go on to make another unsubstantiated conclusion based on a couple of anecdotes. Ha.
      - Doug M says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 10:51
        
        I could puke when I see the word ‘Frontline’ inserted before a role or sector.
      - Sandra says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 12:44
        
        I think many NHS staff have done a fantastic job in very difficult circumstances which is what they are in fact paid (some of them paid very well) to do. But there are also a lot of other people who have continued as normal (or as normally as they can) the whole way through – service men & women running test & trace & vaccination centres, other emergency services like the police & fire services & the energy industry where my OH is employed & without those workers going in every day many other services would not have been able to keep going. This is not by any means a full list and yes, my OH being senior management, has worked from home some days but on those days he’s probably worked a far longer day than he would on site.
Anita says:

6 Jun6 June 08:43

Does anyone know if BAPP 2 4 1 vouchers are being extended please or are we back to the standard 2 years? I need to trigger one before the middle of July but another could wait till mid September. Thanks
- Anna says:
  
  6 Jun6 June 08:53
  
  I need to check as well – I think Rob wrote something about them still getting the extra 6 months but can’t remember when this extends to! But I’m definitely going to hold off till September as even if we don’t get the extra 6 months, the extra award availability will be very useful for us.
  - Chris Heyes says:
    
    6 Jun6 June 09:00
    
    Anna/Anita Wow two girls at once lol BAPP 241 Vouchers are extended Dec21 any earned up to then are extended not sure if 3 or 6 months though no news about after Dec21
    - Anita says:
      
      6 Jun6 June 09:53
      
      Thanks Chris. Equally nerdy with vouchers and miles! 😃
    - Aston100 says:
      
      6 Jun6 June 10:33
      
      Chris – Internet Rule Number 37
  - Rob says:
    
    6 Jun6 June 09:13
    
    All vouchers issued in 2021 get an extra 6 months.
    - Anita says:
      
      6 Jun6 June 09:54
      
      Thanks Rob, that works well for us
- JDB says:
  
  6 Jun6 June 09:00
  
  I triggered mine on 31 May and it has 30 months validity to 30 Nov 2023.
- Jill ( Kinkell) says:
  
  6 Jun6 June 11:49
  
  Yes ..extended by 6 months . Mine triggered end of May and valid until end November 2023. Any voucher earned between June 2020 and end of Dec 21 will be automatically extended by 6 months
babyg_wc says:

6 Jun6 June 08:53

For those flying home from Portugal you may get lucky and be on a 777, which is a nice bonus especially if youre in club!
- Rob says:
  
  6 Jun6 June 09:14
  
  May not make up for cutting a holiday short ….
  - Babyg says:
    
    6 Jun6 June 09:38
    
    indeed, but i believe a few readers on here snapped up some of the extra seats (thanks seatspy) that were made available due to BA putting on the 777. Also at least the flip/flopping government actually gave people some notice, but its still rubbish how they keep doing the hokey tokey with whos in/out of airbridges, travel corridors, traffic light, magic 8ball systems…
- kitten says:
  
  6 Jun6 June 14:27
  
  We might even get someone complaining that their CE seat was only in the PY section instead of the J section on the 777 whereas other CE-booked passengers were seated in the J section.
  
  We had someone recently with that one. I would have felt the same but frankly the complaint “wasn’t going to fly”.
Optimus Prime says:

6 Jun6 June 08:58

If you have a FTV that includes a Companion Voucher, can you use its cash value to pay for a new cash ticket while keeping the Avios and 2×1 on the FTV?
- AJA says:
  
  6 Jun6 June 11:18
  
  No I don’t think you can.
The Savage Squirrel says:

6 Jun6 June 09:22

What’s the functionality of RFF and Seatspy like at the moment? I cancelled my Seatspy membership a while ago because of wrong data issues but now have a couple of alerts I would like to set up.
- Rob says:
  
  6 Jun6 June 09:24
  
  SeatSpy is now fine for BA, RFF is not. SeatSpy has done a deal with BA to get the data it needs.
- Anna says:
  
  6 Jun6 June 09:24
  
  Seatspy seems to have been reliable recently, RFF was totally messed up last time I tried it!
  - Ed says:
    
    6 Jun6 June 09:30
    
    Seems to be a little lag with seat spy, but definitely seems to be working better than it did before
    - Babyg says:
      
      6 Jun6 June 09:42
      
      I kept my seatspy sub through the bad times, as i wanted to keep my cheap(er) monthly fee, its seems pretty good now (not perfect, but worth the price)
      - The Savage Squirrel says:
        
        6 Jun6 June 10:12
        
        Yes I did consider that. I ran the maths as I don’t need it 12 months a year for my normal usage (even in non-Covid times), and a few months here and there when required at full subs will still work out less than 12/12 every year at lower subs. If you use it consistently enough to justify 12/12 subscription then keeping the lower rate locked in was a very sensible move.
Eligold says:

6 Jun6 June 09:53

Is there any way for a family of 6 or more (2 adults) to utilize a 241 voucher?
Say, between me and my wife we have 3 vouchers, 2 vouchers could be used each for 1 adult (voucher holder) and 1 child, but what about the last voucher for 2 kids with neither of them being the voucher holder?
I know with Lloyds upgrade voucher the holder had to travel.
- Eligold says:
  
  6 Jun6 June 09:59
  
  I see a similar discussion above relating to the old Vs new vouchers.
  What is 1+3?
  I’m referring to the old vouchers
  - Genghis says:
    
    6 Jun6 June 10:08
    
    1+3 means one voucher holder using 2 x 241s for 4 people to travel. The other voucher holder could then use their 241 for remaining two people.
    - Anna says:
      
      6 Jun6 June 10:31
      
      I was going to say this. The only risk is that you’re on 2 separate bookings and vulnerable to any complications which arise with your trip. The last time we had a long haul trip (summer 2019, sob), our MAN-LHR connection was cancelled at zero notice. We were fortunately at the airport anyway, but BA tried to send me and my son (on a 241 booking) home for 2 days to wait for the next direct flight, but OH, who was on a cash ticket, was told he was being re-routed the same day via MIA. Needless to say we dug our heels in and they eventually agreed to send the 3 of us in a taxi to LHR to catch the original flight!
  - Rob says:
    
    6 Jun6 June 10:26
    
    Usually the cardholder must be a passenger when a 241 is redeemed – you can’t book a trip for your parents.
    
    If you have two vouchers to redeem, and you use them both at once, this rule doesn’t apply and it becomes 1+3 instead. This allows me to redeem 2 vouchers for me, my wife and the two sproglets.
- Rob says:
  
  6 Jun6 June 10:35
  
  You’re fine. Whoever has 2 vouchers books for 4 people, 1+3, which is allowed.
Flying Misfit says:

6 Jun6 June 09:55

Would be appreciative of any advice. Booked BA2for1 Amex voucher for Club Europe trip for last summer, got cancelled, received BA voucher, and then rebooked the same trip for this summer. Outbound LHR-ATH, Inbound SKG-LHR.
Inbound has been moved to 2 days earlier, 49 hours difference but from what I can tell no change in flight no.
BA Exec club will not let me enter manage my booking for outbound (eg seat selection, add personal details and the like) unless i accept revised itinerary, which i do not want as will lose any rerouting rights. Can I still take outbound despite not having access to manage my booking?
Secondly, with regard to inbound leg, I have offered option on the phone to BA to reroute me from ATH-LHR (of which their is availability on my given day), provided they cover costs for getting from SKG-ATH and no surprise that they didnt accept. My concern is that if I accept the reroute from ATH-LHR and reissue ticket does this mean I can no longer seek compensation for my SKG-ATH costs given their terms of carriage state I have to trump up those extra costs.
Or do I just find a replacement from SKG-LHR with another carrier in similar conditions (bis class), which will inevitably have a stopover (i.e. with Aegean or Lufthansa) and then seek compensation all the way to MCOL if needed from BA given they haven’t rerouted me properly.
Just not sure because it’s not a cancellation from what I can gather, just a schedule change of 49 hours earlier.
- Harry T says:
  
  6 Jun6 June 10:02
  
  A “schedule change” of 48 hours is absolutely a cancellation and rebooking, even with the same flight number, which you are not obliged to accept. You have a right to be rerouted on days and carriers that suit your plans. Unfortunately, BA are often rubbish about this even though they would easily lose in court. My best advice is to hang up and call again until you get someone sensible who respects your rights.
  
  I’m afraid I’m not an expert on the finer details of the MCOL process etc but I expect one of our more knowledgeable, ever helpful commenters like Lady London will be along shortly 😊
  - Lady London says:
    
    6 Jun6 June 11:08
    
    Harry T is right you’ve had a cancellation on your booking so you get to pick what yoy want…flights on your dates of choice or refund.
    
    BA is lying. Just call again in core working hours/days and say when else you want your flights to be. They absokutely have to pay any extra costs if different airports are agreed to by you as well as all meals for waiting time or longer journey time and any extra hotel needed if you choose to travel as close as reasonably possible to the original flight that was cancelled which yours has been. look back on days this thread for posts by Jonathan (eg 2-4 weeks ago) about steps to MCOL if BA is still being silly and mean.
    - Flying Misfit says:
      
      6 Jun6 June 11:16
      
      Will do so re Jonathan posts, thank you both
    - Lady London says:
      
      6 Jun6 June 11:22
      
      ps be careful I believe the words in EU261 refer to hotel/meals covered if you take a later flight as close as poss to your cancelled one – the words say later IIRC the word earlier flight is not there
      
      You also have the right for BA to provide replacement flights on another airline if BA hasn’t got the flights you need when you need to travel. BA disobeys the law by denying this systematically according to reports unless occasionally it’s an airline they specifically have a revenue-sharing agreementor other beneficial deal with. So you could ask to come back o , say, Aegean /Olympic etc if you need to come back asap to when you booked or a later date if BA has no flights of your own. BA will force you to mcol them though and you’ll win – so if BA is forcing you to mcol anyway I’d defo not restrict myself to coming home on their flights if other airlines can fly me much, much nearer to my cancelled flight date than BA can if BA is being particularly unreasonable about reaching Athens. They tried that with meta and it cost them a lot when he MCOLed. BA knew it was hopeless so they settled before the mcol hearing date.
Bill says:

6 Jun6 June 10:15

Please remind me, how do I check if I have got any Lloyd’s upgrade vouchers from their credit card
- meta says:
  
  6 Jun6 June 10:28
  
  You need to call.
  - meta says:
    
    6 Jun6 June 10:29
    
    To add, you need to call Avios team Mon-Fri.
- Tom1 says:
  
  6 Jun6 June 10:29
  
  Think calling Avios is the only way – might be corrected but don’t think Lloyds vouchers show in BAEC.
  - Bill says:
    
    6 Jun6 June 10:32
    
    Thanks for the info
- Andrew M says:
  
  6 Jun6 June 10:33
  
  The best way I’ve found is to log into your Avios account (not BA) and use the chat function. You can probably also call Avios (not BA), though I haven’t done it.