The new HFP chat thread – Saturday 2nd May

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• Sarah says:

  2 May2 May 06:40

  Pangolin and bat.

  • Tom says:

    2 May2 May 07:07

    Normal.

  • Kev M says:

    2 May2 May 09:16

    Yum! That’s dinner sorted then 🤨

  • BrightonReader says:

    2 May2 May 15:32

    Not the best firm of solicitors but then not the worst.

    • ankomonkey says:

      2 May2 May 16:19

      🙂

• BJ says:

  2 May2 May 07:01

  Amex Travel and BA hotel only bookings: What are readers experiences when attempting to cancel or change nonrefundable hotel reservations? Specifically at chains with Covid-19 policies that now allow changes or cancellations had the reservations been made via their own website as opposed to third party sites? I had made one reservation each at Accor and IHG to take advantage of the £50 amex offer. I have a similar issue with one reservation for a hotel only at BA. The reservations were all cash only, no membership reward points or avios were involved. Thanks.

  • Rob says:

    2 May2 May 08:53

    My understanding from IHG (not sure about Accor) is that rooms are refundable however they were booked, but don’t quote me on that.

    If the hotel is closed, of course, you are due a refund anyway.

    • BJ says:

      2 May2 May 09:02

      Thanks Rob, my understanding too. Was just wondering if amex and BA were handling these refunds smoothly m, I’ve been holding off contacting them until two weeks prior to arrival. Policies on Accor look like a dogs breakfast.

      • Jody says:

        2 May2 May 09:31

        I was due to stay at a Marriott hotel in Seattle in the middle of May. Booked through Amex travel on a non refundable rate.

        I was called by Amex travel last week telling me they could cancel it and I would get a full refund. Was told it could take up to 8 weeks, but the refund hit my account yesterday. Very impressed with how it was handled.

    • r* says:

      2 May2 May 09:52

      Holiday inn express milan was closed and both ihg and the hotel absolutely refused to give a refund and would only give a voucher, ive had to try a chargeback. Was very disappointed with them.

    • WZ says:

      2 May2 May 11:52

      Hey Rob, Is this the same for all hotels or just the chains mentioned above?

      I booked a Marriott hotel through OTA and got confirmation from the hotel that they are closed but OTA will only issue a voucher. If the hotel has confirmed they are closed do you think that would be helpful when claiming on S75.

      • Rob says:

        2 May2 May 14:50

        If the hotel is closed you have a clear chargeback claim (perhaps not Section 75 as its an agent, but a chargeback). Not an issue.

        Not sure what the Marriott refund rule is off the top of my head but if you check their website it will tell you. The OTA is just sitting on your cash – it has either been refunded or was never paid in the first place.

  • mark says:

    2 May2 May 10:14

    had several rooms booked in Krakow for this weekend at Accor brand hotels booked through Hotels.com. All cancelled and awaiting refund however it was a marathon to get there – Spoke to Hotels.com gold line several times and demanded they get my money back from Accor – quoted Accor policy on their web site and eventually got there – just waiting for my money as they say it could take 30 days.

  • BJ says:

    2 May2 May 11:07

    Thanks everybody for the helpful feedback. I’ll sit on this until two weeks prior to arrival dates unless they contact me before then. I’ll obviously request refunds but could live with vouchers for the hotels in question if it comes to that.

    • Paul says:

      2 May2 May 14:00

      I had two non-refundable IHG reservations for NYC at the end of May and was waiting until 2 weeks before to contact Amex Travel. On Thursday I had an email from them inviting me to call to re-strange or cancel. Got through to a lovely agent in less than a minute and full refund offered. Call only lasted a couple of minutes and the cancellation emails folllowed within a couple of minutes. Very impressed.

      • Paul says:

        2 May2 May 14:02

        Also used the £50 Amex offer which I’m expecting to be clawed back once the refund posts

        • Flyoff says:

          2 May2 May 21:48

          All 4 of my £50 rebates were all clawed back after accommodation and events were cancelled by the hotel/operator. I can’t complain but thought Amex processes may let some slip through the net. Overall Amex travel were brilliant at managing the cancellations and refunds.

      • BJ says:

        2 May2 May 17:57

        Thanks Paul, sounds like they are organised at amex given that they are proactively contacting customers.

• Robbie says:

  2 May2 May 07:50

  250,000 Virgin Points.

  If I use them as part payment on a virginholidays and they go bust what refund would I be due?

  • Peter K says:

    2 May2 May 08:14

    I don’t think anyone really knows.

  • Dezbez says:

    2 May2 May 08:17

    It’s difficult to find a definitive answer. This is an approach I’ve taken – I’ve booked a hotel through Virgin Holidays (already had BA flights booked), then paid £102 deposit on my card, & used a portion of my VFC airmiles to pay off some of the balance. You get 0.55p/mile so not great, but better than some other options. In terms of protection, I’m hoping (/gambling!) that S75 would cover everything paid so far, not just the card deposit, although i don’t think this has been tested/proven. Where the holiday includes flights, you would also get ABTA/ATOL protection – not sure what this would cover, though. Hopefully none of this will be needed!

  • BJ says:

    2 May2 May 08:30

    I don’t think Virgin is going bust, they have three big things in their favour: brand, LHR slots and a route to undermine BA if a competitor wants to do so. If you want to be cautious sink the miles in flights only and book fully flexible hotels via the hotels own website. Haven’t seen it mentioned here but I’m wondering if as a last resort we could claim back APD from HMRC?

    • Marcw says:

      2 May2 May 08:31

      Virgin is going bust, sooner rather than later.

      • Marcw says:

        2 May2 May 08:33

        Why? The commercial aviation future is in jeopardy. Very challenging times ahead for the whole industry. Smaller players will suffer, and many will collapse. Virgin Atlantic is a good candidate going bust.

        • Secret Squirrel says:

          2 May2 May 12:35

          Looks like things could be on the move flight wise, recent statement from AA stating from May 11th all passengers must wear masks, anti bac gels & wipes, deep cleaning of cabins to start flying again.

        • marcw says:

          2 May2 May 16:30

          @SecretSquirrel that doesn´t solve the problem of reduced demand.

      • BJ says:

        2 May2 May 09:04

        I know but I just got a feeling (hope?) something will see Virgin through at the last minute.

      • james says:

        2 May2 May 10:23

        OMG aren’t we over these idiots already?

        • marcw says:

          2 May2 May 11:28

          I´m sorry. But I´ve never insulted anyone. You may agree or disagree with me, completely understandable if you don´t, but first and foremost, be respectful.

      • marcw says:

        2 May2 May 11:19

        J, I don´t want Virgin Atlantic fail. But like many other business, they won´t survive this tornado; no matter how much taxpayers cash they receive, they won´t make it. They are a purely long haul airline… and long haul flight will be the last one restarting. And I haven´t considered profitability; I suspect airlines won´t post profits in the next 3 years (at least!).

        They key question is whether taxpayer should sustain failing business. I don´t think so. You can agree or disagree with me in that matter, but the 1st paragraph remains valid.

      • David says:

        3 May3 May 02:29

        Please bore off marcw. Every day banging the same boring drum.

    • Doug M says:

      2 May2 May 09:09

      @BJ – Virgin have had those 3 things for the last 20 years, when problems begin they had about 5 minutes worth of cash reserves. If they don’t go bust it’ll because the gov (that’s us the UK tax payer) is bailing them out, not because they have brand, slots or route.

      • TGLoyalty says:

        2 May2 May 10:12

        A guaranteed loan ISNT a bailout

        • Doug M says:

          2 May2 May 10:38

          A loan they’ll only get if the gov underwrite the risk. Why won’t a commercial lender take the risk? If it happens it’ll be a bailout that may be paid back.

        • TGLoyalty says:

          2 May2 May 17:10

          Right now? Because the bank will see they aren’t operating many flights, no idea when they will restart and they operate with leased aircraft so not much to secure it against.

      • BJ says:

        2 May2 May 11:14

        And they have struggled along and hopefully can do so for a while longer. Only Virgin flights I ever took were Little Red and they are of little use to me personally. However, for the sake of their staff, customers, and competition I hope they live to fight another day.

        • Doug M says:

          2 May2 May 14:14

          Me too, I always feel for the staff. Just suggesting that Virgin’s business model was never great to begin with.

    • ChrisC says:

      2 May2 May 17:55

      ” if as a last resort we could claim back APD from HMRC?”

      No. APD is the liability of the airline not the passenger.

      • BJ says:

        2 May2 May 18:27

        Interesting, I thought the pax were liable and the airlines just collected it and paid it on our behalf? If not, then why can we claim APD refunds in some cases, or am I misunderstanding that too?

        • marcw says:

          2 May2 May 19:18

          Mmmmhhh… it´s charged to the airline for each passenger they transport. If the airline is an IATA member, then the price is fragmented (fare, taxes, duties, surcharge), so you can see what goes where. So it´s difficult for IATA airlines to offer pricse below the required taxes. Other airlines, like Ryanair – which are not members of the IATA – do whatever they like, they can charge GBP1/10/0.01 whatever, This is just a general rule.

          But APD is charged to the airline for each transported passenger.

        • ChrisC says:

          2 May2 May 22:25

          If you don’t fly then it’s not paid to HMRC

          Because the airline has listed it in it’s separate list of fees etc then it refunds you – just like airport fees

          If it includes it in the base fare then it’s not under any obligation to refund (unless a base fare refund is part of the T&Cs)

          In anycase it’s only paid to HMRC once you have flown and HMRC have no idea of the names of any passengers on flights. So trying to claim from them would be a waste of time.

          There is no obligation for an airline to charge a passenger fees and taxes in cash as long as it pays them to the approriate body of course – hence BA offers part pay with avios where the cash element can be lower than the fees and taxes

        • BJ says:

          2 May2 May 23:40

          Thanks Marc and Chris, appreciate the explanations. Always good to turn vague ideas into more concrete understanding.

  • Rob says:

    2 May2 May 08:52

    It was 0.6p https://headforpoints.com/2019/03/02/redeem-virgin-flying-club-miles-on-virgin-holidays/ but has now dropped to 0.55p last time I checked. That would mean just under £1,400.

    Upside is that you are guaranteed a refund or a holiday if Virgin goes bust due to the ATOL protection.

• Green Plastic says:

  2 May2 May 07:56

  Morning all. Subscribed to the Economist a few weeks ago and got the 15,000 avios on the promotion. Now received an email saying the magazine will be delayed in the post for the foreseeable as Royal Mail stopping Saturday deliveries. This is annoying as I liked reading it on a Saturday and I don’t get as much free time during the week to enjoy it. If I cancel the subscription am I likely to lose the avios?

  • BJ says:

    2 May2 May 08:06

    Yes, so best just keep it and read the following weekend. Did you get you avios already? A reader was asking a few days ago how long they were taking to post.

    • MD says:

      2 May2 May 08:32

      As a data point, I took out a digital only subscription on 01/04/20 and the avios posted on 26/04/20.

    • Green Plastic says:

      2 May2 May 09:59

      Yes I received the avios this week, took about 3 weeks to post

  • TGLoyalty says:

    2 May2 May 10:14

    You could cancel but I believe the rules say they can claw the Avios back if it is.

  • Harry T says:

    2 May2 May 13:15

    I appreciate the value of a physical copy but the app is actually rather good.

• BJ says:

  2 May2 May 08:55

  Good stuff Crafty. I only recently discovered the ability to send an online card from Card Factory with a personalised greeting to somebody via the post. A great service, particularly at this time. Happy to support you and your colleagues in this initiative to help the NHS.

  • Anna says:

    2 May2 May 11:31

    +1 and I did not know that about Card Factory!

  • Crafty says:

    3 May3 May 00:29

    Thanks BJ. We aren’t the only ones to offer personalised cards (Moonpig have the highest share of that particular market), but we do have lower prices.

    • Crafty says:

      3 May3 May 08:40

      Interesting business model, though. I don’t think e-cards will ever take over from real cards, that ship sailed decades ago, but Jacquie Lawson is popular for a (very) small minority and makes an enormous profit margin.

      It’s owned by American Greetings, which is one of the two behemoth publishers that have an oligopoly in the US market.

• Dave says:

  2 May2 May 09:01

  Amex platinum insurance question…my card year runs until October. I was thinking of cancelling the card as being stuck at home means I can’t use the benefits but as I have a couple of holidays booked I guess it’s worth keeping for the insurance. Some insurers seem to be excluding Covid 19 related stuff from new policies. When my card renews in October does that count as anew policy or a continuation of the existing one?

  • Travel Strong says:

    2 May2 May 09:39

    What elements of the insurance are you worried about keeping for future travel? For example…

    If its medical cost cover – a new policy will often still cover you so long as FCO are not advising against travel still when you go.

    If its cancellation/curtailment cover – how are your future bookings set up? Flights booked on a credit card are covered already. And flexible hotel/car hire/airport parking etc is easily cancelled without insurance.

    I am in the same position and will be cancelling platinum even though I have 6 bookings over the next 12 months (6 sets of flights, non paid in advance flex car rentals, non paid in advance flex hotel reservations or airbnb reservations, and airport parking that is cancellable/refundable).

  • Travel Strong says:

    2 May2 May 09:40

    (Also interested to hear is there are risks I have not considered in the above! Before I cancel mine 🙂 )

• Anna says:

  2 May2 May 09:01

  Just remind me about credit card protection! We’ve got some fitted wardrobes on order from a local company to hopefully be installed in the next few months. They don’t take Amex so I intend to pay the bulk of it through Billhop as we’d like to take my nephew on his first long haul holiday with us next year and need an extra 2 4 1. If I pay the £500 deposit on MasterCard, would I then be covered for the whole £4k if the firm were to go bust (hoping they don’t, of course)?

  • Gavin says:

    2 May2 May 09:34

    Yes, you should be covered by S75 as long as your put any part of the payment on a credit card.

    • Anna says:

      2 May2 May 11:35

      👍

    • Anna says:

      2 May2 May 15:18

      Thanks, no it’ll being going directly on to my IHG card!

    • Stuart says:

      2 May2 May 16:37

      Would S75 come into effect if I needed it if I paid for holiday accommodation on a Curve card linked to a MasterCard? Not sure if this counts as a debit or credit card transaction

      • Optimus Prime says:

        2 May2 May 17:00

        You would depend on Curve Purchase Protection – no S75 from the underlying credit card.

• N says:

  2 May2 May 09:05

  Fraud on my Curve two days ago (£350ish at Game.co.uk), card cancelled, transaction refunded. Card still in my possession.

  A friend who I introduced to Curve had exactly the same yesterday.

  Anyone else?

  • Peter K says:

    2 May2 May 22:56

    Not me

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