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The new HFP chat thread – Wednesday 29th April

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We have decided to run this new daily chat thread on Head for Points.

Historically, the daily ‘Bits’ articles were the defacto repository for random comments and questions.  It is unlikely that the news flow will be so big over the next few weeks that we will need many ‘Bits’ articles, however.

The comments under this article are where you should post questions about travel and, indeed, anything else on your mind.  At this tricky time, and given that many of you are stuck at home self-isolating, we want the HFP community to have a place to chat.

Please only comment under the main articles on the site if your comment is directly related to the topic of the article.  This has long-term benefits as its keeps the commentary relevant for people who read those articles in the future.

By default, HFP shows the last page of comments under the article.  If you want to see the first page of comments and read them all from beginning to end in order, click here: https://hfp2022.headforpoints.blog/2020/04/29/the-new-hfp-chat-thread-wednesday-29th-april/comment-page-1 The page will refresh with this article but the comments will now show the first page and not the last page.

We will continue to monitor how this is working.  Let’s see how it goes.  Take care!

Category

General

Comments (360)

This article is closed to new posts. Discussion continues in the HfP Forums.

  • The Original Nick says:
    29 Apr29 April 07:06

    Morning all. Has anyone had a eurostar booking cancelled due to the Coronavirus?

    • MD says:
      29 Apr29 April 08:33

      Good question, especially as I’m supposed to be travelling to Paris this Friday – Sunday and have heard precisely zero from Eurostar! They seem to be playing extreme brinkmanship to avoid any refunds.

      As I’m sure you’ve seen on their homepage it offers the ability to rebook to any other time for free, not much use to me at present.

      Elsewhere they state “We can offer you an eVoucher instead. It’ll be equal to the full value of your booking and valid until 30 September 2020 for travel up to the end of March 2021.”

      What they mysteriously don’t state is what happens if THEY cancel your train. Are you entitled to a cash refund? Legally I would think so. Given that they’ve only been running one train a day each way, 1131 to Paris and 1643 back, every time I check (not my travel times) I’m just sitting tight and waiting for them to cancel my trip.

    • Doug M says:
      29 Apr29 April 09:19

      As best as I can see they seem to be announcing the schedule only a day or two in advance, effectively meaning cancellations are at 48 hours. But they have a voucher offer. The whole thing is clearly structured to resist paying refunds. I’m sitting on two tickets for early and mid May, will wait it out and then cancel, if by chance my trains run I’ll take the voucher as a last resort.

  • revlou says:
    29 Apr29 April 07:27

    I would like a cash refund from BA from a flight they cancelled. I successfully managed to submit the “workaround” cash refund over a month ago (before they helpfully rewired their website) but have heard nothing from them and have had no refund. I have tried calling them 10 times over the past month (at different times of the day) each to a nice recording of a lady telling me they are “putting their staff first” [by removing the refund option on their website…]. Would it be unreasonable of me to submit a Section 75 claim now?

    • Save East Coast Rewards says:
      29 Apr29 April 07:41

      I’m in the same situation with BA. I have a feeling some of the claims have somehow fell through the cracks. I’ve not tried any S75 or chargeback on BA as yet.

      Lefthansa on the other hand weren’t budging on a refund (they weren’t processing them at present) so I have raised a refund request with Amex. This is taking a while, I opened it on the 3rd April (after trying to deal with it direct with LH), and so it’s important to remember that the card companies are also bogged down with requests.

      So with BA I’m going to give them a little more time. I’ve had luck getting through if I call closer to closing time, avoid during the day because if BA are cancelling flights that is when the notifications come through.

      • BJ says:
        29 Apr29 April 09:08

        @East Coast, id you see comments about LNER vouchers? Some reported one year extensions after contacting then via twitter. @Baji extended to end of 2021 IIRC. By contrast, I raised an online support ticket so I’ll probably need to wait a while for a response.

        • Save East Coast Rewards says:
          29 Apr29 April 09:49

          I hadn’t heard of the extensions definitely happening but I was confident that they would offer extensions. Normal customer relations channels will be very busy, but social media seems relatively quiet (with few people travelling right now)

        • Baji Nahid says:
          29 Apr29 April 12:21

          Hi yes, My vouchers were extended till end of 2021 but i guess it may just be depending on the agent running the twitter account at the time, others are getting a one year extension based on the day they make the enquiry on twitter. So best message the social media team and see what they can do!

    • Reeferman says:
      29 Apr29 April 08:07

      It is clearly hit-and-miss with BA. I phoned at the beginning of April for a refund on 4 flights for May that were cancelled a day or two previously. I got through quickly, gave all the details and was told the refund (cash and AVIOS) would be back within a couple of weeks.
      A few days ago, BA cancelled another batch of 4 flights for June – so I phoned for a cash/AVIOS refund (and got through quickly) on those and also chased-up on the first 4 flights as I’d heard/received nothing back.
      Within 48 hours – refunds for all 8 have started to appear!

    • Doug M says:
      29 Apr29 April 09:47

      If you have a Flyertalk account just PM the refund helper.

      • Steve says:
        29 Apr29 April 13:52

        Definitely this. The flyer talk approach is super fast and almost nil effort. Even if you don’t have an account it takes 5 minutes to set up, which is far quicker than queueing.

  • The Savage Squirrel says:
    29 Apr29 April 07:33

    No Ryanair I requested a cash refund not a voucher….. a story everyone here is familiar with from one airline or another. Who wants a sweep on how long I’ll be on Live Chat before I get an answer; started 7AM :D.

    • Jonathan says:
      29 Apr29 April 07:48

      I’ve had it open for 6+ hours on a couple of days (including starting 5mins before 6AM opening) & not made it through to an agent! Given up trying now, will give it another month then do chargeback if they’ve not sorted themselves out by now.

    • Spursdebs says:
      29 Apr29 April 07:49

      98 mins

      • Spursdebs says:
        29 Apr29 April 08:18

        I’ve just read elsewhere someone waited 24hrs and no reply so I’ll revise my guess to the 12th of never and 98mins.

    • ChrisW says:
      29 Apr29 April 08:53

      my wife and I were in the same position, in the end we claimed a charge back via Amex stating Ryanair were not fulfilling their European rights of a cash refund on a cancelled flight and received a statement credit for the full amount.

    • Darren says:
      29 Apr29 April 10:19

      No answer yet?

      • The Savage Squirrel says:
        29 Apr29 April 12:16

        Well we have a result! I had an interaction with chat where they acknowledged that I had declined the refund and requested a cash payment. 1 hr 48 mins so see if you’re a winner (what a world we live in when that’s much better than expected :D!). They said I would receive an Email shortly after to that effect … which of course hasn’t arrived. Will probably give it 7 days for at least an acknowledgement and then go for chargeback. Screenshot of chat taken of course.

        • The Savage Squirrel says:
          29 Apr29 April 12:17

          I see Spurs Debs was very close – I declare a winner!

  • Carl says:
    29 Apr29 April 07:44

    When downgrading a BAPP to the free card do I just apply for the free card online or should I call Amex? Also, does it do a credit check again/leave a footprint on my credit file and am I likely to keep my credit limit on the new card?

    • Save East Coast Rewards says:
      29 Apr29 April 08:00

      When I moved from BAPP -> BA free (a couple of years ago to be fair when I wasn’t expecting to travel much) I was told to apply online but when approved everything from my old account including the limit carried over and I could use the old BAPP card until the new ones arrived and were activated.

      I then upgraded again early last year when my spending had started to increase (as I was spending a lot of time and money in hotels as well as other business costs) and the changeover was also seamless.

    • Secret Squirrel says:
      29 Apr29 April 08:10

      I called up, took less than 3 mins previously when I last done it.

    • Gavin says:
      29 Apr29 April 08:25

      I called up and the agent processed a new application for me on the phone, including asking all the questions. So it would have been quicker to do it myself online.

    • shd says:
      29 Apr29 April 08:26

      > When downgrading a BAPP to the free card…

      What’s the reason for downgrading rather than just cancelling outright?

      I cancelled my BAPP last night, 3/4 of the annual fee has been refunded overnight. Figure that starts the clock ticking, if/when life returns to normal I can reapply for whichever BA Amex is around by then. My 241 might even still be valid 🙂

      • Save East Coast Rewards says:
        29 Apr29 April 08:34

        Personally I’d be very wary of cancelling any cards at the moment as we don’t know what the market will be like after things start returning to normal.

        Look at Hilton, most people expected once the current Hilton credit card stopped being offered to new customers that either a new credit card would appear soon or the existing card would soon turn into a generic Barclaycard. It didn’t happen so people who wanted a Hilton card in the last few years were out of luck unless they had kept hold of theirs

      • Secret Squirrel says:
        29 Apr29 April 08:59

        Holding onto an Amex avios earning card that you still can earn a 241 voucher per year, also enables to upgrade to BAPP easily.

      • Rob says:
        29 Apr29 April 09:15

        You can do it either way. However, if you’re on the free card you could, for eg, spend £9k towards your next voucher then only upgrade for a few weeks – over the period when you hit £10k – before downgrading again.

      • Carl says:
        29 Apr29 April 14:06

        Because I still have a 241 voucher to use so need an Amex card, my BAPP is in negative points territory with all the recent refunds plus it now puts my next 241 voucher in the unlikely to hit target spend zone and I’ve only just ticked over in to the new card year so will get 10/12 months refund on fees.

    • BJ says:
      29 Apr29 April 09:16

      System changed a few weeks ago. Now when you apply for Blue it recognises if you have BAPP and asks you if you want to sign in to your account to request a downgrade. I recommend you do as it is quicker and easier than the rigmarole over the phone. Use phone only if you are hoping for a retention offer.

    • Carl says:
      29 Apr29 April 14:02

      Great, thanks for all the replies

      • Polly says:
        30 Apr30 April 14:29

        Yes, took about 3 mins in total, without the questioning, which l hate…

  • Tyra says:
    29 Apr29 April 07:58

    I’m thinking of transferring my Virgin miles to Hilton now (as it can take up to 30 days), so at least I can get some use out of them in the future. What are other people thinking/doing? I couldn’t see any other airlines schemes I can combine them with.

    • Save East Coast Rewards says:
      29 Apr29 April 08:23

      For me it was easy – Hilton points have value for me despite earning loads due to business travel (as it’s my own company I can always use points to save money on business travel if my balance gets out of control).

      Most of my VS miles came from train travel, plus Tesco when there was a promo on, my last VS flights were on Little Red in 2015. Unfortunately VS rarely flies where i need to go so even when VS wasn’t in financial difficulty I had considered moving the miles over to Hilton.

      Your situation might be different – if the Hilton points hold little value to you but you have use for the VS miles should VS survive then I’d keep them in VS. Only you can decide where they’re most use to you.

      If we go back to 2012 many people panic redeemed their bmi miles on Star Alliance flights they didn’t really want as they expected BA to give a poor offer to diamond club members. As I has no reason to book flights I didn’t need I held onto my bmi miles and was happy that BA allowed transfer to BAEC and also BA kept the diamond club credit card going for years after (offered a better rate than their own Amex).

      The lesson from this is:
      – If VS miles have value to you, then don’t panic transfer them out unless you really will suffer hardship if they become worthless
      – If you have a lot of value in Hilton/IHG points and rarely use VS then transfer out
      – If you have a VS credit card then don’t panic cancel it, maybe stop using it for a while but don’t cancel the card. As well as the bmi card mentioned above I’m sure those who cancelled the Hilton credit card in the past probably regret it now.

      • TripRep says:
        29 Apr29 April 08:33

        I emptied half my VS balance to Hilton.

        Still have VS flights booked in the winter that I might need miles to upgrade PE to UC. That said I’m undecided about keeping those flights too, VS could well be gone by then.

        • Save East Coast Rewards says:
          29 Apr29 April 08:41

          That seems to be a sensible approach in your situation. If your current flights are booked as cash fares presumably you can’t get a full refund unless they cancel so you’re best to hold on for now and allow your credit card sort it if they go bust.

          • BJ says:
            29 Apr29 April 09:24

            I disagree, I would move the lot. It’s not panic, I’ve done so as a matter of routine forever. Unless you are near London and use FC miles on UC at Xmas then they are more valuable converted tohilyon if you stay at hotels and use then wisely.

          • The Savage Squirrel says:
            29 Apr29 April 12:22

            My full stash has arrived at Hilton. My personal valuation now differs from the “standard” model as Hilton are more liquid (you can easily spend a smaller amount of Hilton and still get something useful) and are spendable in the UK while VS are not – which alone makes Hilton significantly more valuable in relative terms, at least in the short term – so the loss in value is not quite as steep to me as the “official” HfP value figures.

          • Rob says:
            29 Apr29 April 12:59

            You can’t value them at more than you can buy them for, which is 0.4p when a 100% bonus is on.

      • Rob says:
        29 Apr29 April 09:22

        Indeed. Literally anything could happen. Nothing (since money is not an object) stops Emirates popping up and offering £500m for 49% – as they do no Europe to North America routes at the moment it could be interesting – and suddenly becoming a VFC partner. If Qatar wasn’t an IAG investor I could imagine them being keen as well.

        The key thing with Virgin is that the money we’re talking about to save it is not much in the big scheme of things. £500m is the cost of three long haul aircraft.

        • Rum says:
          29 Apr29 April 09:51

          Those Heathrow take-off and landing slots must be worth quite a bit as well to any potential buyer/investor…

        • Genghis says:
          29 Apr29 April 10:45

          ” as they do no Europe to North America routes at the moment”
          Don’t EK still have the fifth freedom MXP to JFK?

    • Steve says:
      29 Apr29 April 09:30

      I have thought long and hard about it but at the moment I’m sticking with Virgin and putting faith in someone investing or government bailing them out in the end. I had my eye on a trip to Japan using my Virgin miles, which I still want to do. Hilton points are not of massive interest to me – I’ve never really dabbled in hotel points on the basis that my enjoyment of the hobby comes purely from flying in premium cabins that I otherwise would never dream of paying for. If there’s any chance of Virgin pulling through then I want to be able to fly with them. Most of my miles are with BA so my points are diversified somewhat, which helps a little.

      • Andrew MS says:
        29 Apr29 April 13:05

        I am the same – it takes me a couple of years to save the miles to fly UC with Virgin . When I get to where I am going , I prefer to keep it rural and the Hiltons are in the city of course..
        I have booked my flight to South Africa for March next year so fingers crossed.

  • David Johnson says:
    29 Apr29 April 08:01

    Will you be doing a new thread on the BA data breach claim? I believe you were going to seek legal advice and write another article.

  • Tucker says:
    29 Apr29 April 08:18

    Has anyone had any luck extending a Lloyds upgrade voucher?

  • Ali says:
    29 Apr29 April 08:49

    Hi guys
    have a predicament.
    Have a 6th May booking for an airline from Asia – have read my insurance terms and conditions and it says in FAQs :
    Q-I am unable to travel due to the most recent update from the government. What should I do?
    Answer. ‘You should first ask your airline or travel provider to postpone your trip or arrange a refund, this applies for both trips abroad and in the UK’
    I am doubtful of my English comprehension but feel I should ask the travel agent to refund because the airline in question is not the most reliable and likely won’t ‘cancel’ the flight. Don’t want the date to pass and then the insurance claim to be discarded with ‘well if it was the FCO advice you were worried about,you should have cancelled BEFORE the flight.
    What would peeps do?

    • Rob says:
      29 Apr29 April 09:10

      You’re not unable to travel – the UK Government will let you go. Depends on the rules of where you are going, of course, as to whether you could get in. The agent can’t do anything that the airline cannot do – clearly the agent won’t give you your money back if the airline won’t give it to the agent.

      • Ali says:
        29 Apr29 April 09:15

        Thanks Rob.
        The flight is from Pakistan to Saudia Arabia – both airspaces are closed but I trust Pakistan International airlines to NOT cancel anything even though the flight won’t happen.
        My question is though that do I wait for a cancellation from the airline (which won’t happen) or looking at the travel insurer’s website : ‘ask to cancel’ due to FCO advice and expect the travel insurance to cover the costs.

        • mr_jetlag says:
          29 Apr29 April 09:18

          If the flight “doesn’t happen” then it’s cancelled. You can get a record of this from several places (flightstats, etc) for days afterwards.

          If you are unwilling to go and the flight isn’t cancelled, the terms of your agent booking apply.

          • Ali says:
            29 Apr29 April 09:43

            ok thank you.
            Will have a look and keep records accordingly.
            Regards

    • Dave says:
      29 Apr29 April 09:18

      Hi Ali, I would wait until closer to the date for the cancellation. I still have flights in the coming weeks with easyjet and BA that have not been cancelled. Why do you think a an unreliable airline won’t cancel the flight? Surely they’re the most likely to. Which airline is it? For the travel insurance, I think you can claim after the intended travel date.

      • mr_jetlag says:
        29 Apr29 April 09:21

        I think in this case OP is getting cold feet and is hoping the airline will cancel otherwise there is no refund available. I agree he/she should just wait till the flight date comes and goes unless there is a no show fee.

      • Ali says:
        29 Apr29 April 10:34

        Hi,
        its Pakistan International airlines.
        agreed @ cold feet due to risk of losing out and being told by insurer later ‘oh well we dont cover for no shows’.
        I know the flights wont happen because Pakistan’s air space is closed until 15th May and Saudia Arabia don’t have any incoming international flights from Pakistan for the foreseeable future…
        I’ll keep a record of the flight stats as suggested above and not cancel as per your advice and then if the airline isn’t refunding to the travel agent – can take it up with insurance.
        Thank you both x

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