Creation cancelling credit cards which have been used with a Curve Card

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• J says:

  1 Oct1 October 15:56

  I wonder whether the common theme might be not so much Curve use as the method used to pay Creation? Everyone who ever used beardy, perhaps?

  • Craig says:

    1 Oct1 October 15:57

    Always paid by direct debit from my bank account.

    • john browell says:

      1 Oct1 October 16:01

      Same here, direct debit, balance in full, every month.
      I’m going to miss having IHG platinum status, for the limited benefits, and miss the free night certificates.
      Luckily I just used one to book an Intercontinental in London for December, and have one left to use.

• Jamjaw says:

  1 Oct1 October 15:58

  I am due to be charge my account fee this month – will they have the gumption to use it. Not used card since the text – was only used with curve and not for a long time with NS&!I or HMRC – Can I get £10k spend to trigger another voucher before 3 Dec….

  • Froggee says:

    1 Oct1 October 16:53

    It depends how much you want a fight with them as it wouldn’t surprise me if they insist that the free night only comes on the card anniversary date so tough luck etc. If you haven’t used it since the start of the new card year then I’d just cancel, once the free night has hit your IHG account and move on. That will be my strategy when I hopefully get might on the 22nd. It also feels nice to dump them before they dump me as I don’t need to give them two months notice 🙂

    • Froggee says:

      1 Oct1 October 16:54

      mine^ not might!

    • JDB says:

      1 Oct1 October 17:03

      The Ombudsman has previously made a determination in 2018 about the free night voucher and refers back to the original terms signed by the customer relating to rewards (rather than the CCA 1974) in April 2017, so people might be advised to look at those if they can find them.

      “He [customer] says this doesn’t say that you have to wait until the anniversary to benefit from the free night and I agree. But I [Ombudsman] don’t think these headline benefits have to document all the details behind the benefits. For example the headline doesn’t explain how many hotels the voucher can be used at or at what locations. These conditions like those that apply to the free night are enlarged upon in the full terms that Mr G signed and had access to.
      I think it’s reasonable for Creation to expect consumers to look at the terms and conditions to understand how the benefits are applied and I don’t think their explanation of how the voucher can be obtained is confusing. And for those reasons I don’t think Creation has done anything wrong here.”

      • JDB says:

        1 Oct1 October 17:09

        It’s decision DRN2242979 in case anyone wants to read the whole thing. There seem to be some rather utopian expectations for ‘compensation’ here!

        • Jonathan says:

          1 Oct1 October 19:05

          Big difference between not wanting to wait till the anniversary but having the opportunity to do so as account remained open & having your account closed (without any proof of breaching T&C’s) Creation unilaterally acting to deny a voucher that had been due once £10k spent.

• jj says:

  1 Oct1 October 16:01

  I had already planned to bin my card, as IHG has very few hotels that I actually want to use. So, assuming that I receive the letter (I have engaged in no MS at all but have used Curve), I won’t be taking things any further.

  I work in financial services, so here are a couple of pointers for anyone who wants to take this further. It is important not to be persuaded by reference to Clause 14 of the T&Cs: FCA regulated firms must follow the FCA’s Principles, and these override any contractual rights the firm may have. Principle 6 says, “A firm must pay due regard to the interests of its customers and treat them fairly,” and this is expanded into six consumer outcomes. Outcome 5 says, “Consumers are provided with products that perform as firms have led them to expect, and the associated service is of an acceptable standard and as they have been led to expect.”

  In taking out a Creation credit card, a consumer has been led to expect that:

  – Their annual fee will provide access to their credit card for a full year
  – They will have a full 12 months in which to spend £10,000 to earn a voucher
  – They will be able to enjoy 12 months of opportunity to earn IHG points
  – The IHG points earned would count toward IHG status

  Unless you have broken the T&Cs yourself (for example by using the card for online gambling), it is reasonable to ask Creation to provide adequate compensation for the loss of those services that you expected to receive:

  – You should expect a pro-rata refund of your fee, even if you have already earned a voucher, as the fee is intended also to cover provision of the card and chance to earn points.
  – If you no longer have enought time to earn a free night voucher, you should ask for suitable compensation.
  – If you are left with orphan IHG points that are insufficient for a meaningful redemption, you should seek compensation.
  – If the closure means you will fail to reach Spire status, you should seek compensation.
  – If you passed over the opportunity to earn a welcome bonus from another card provider because you were tempted by Creation’s offer, you should seek compensation.

  Make sure that your objections are formally recorded as a complaint. If Creation is unable to resolve your complaint to your satisfaction, they must grant you the right to go the the Financial Ombudsman. When that happens, make sure that you use the FCA’s language around Principle 6 and Outcome 5.

  It should be a slam-dunk.

  • Neil Spellings says:

    1 Oct1 October 16:07

    Rob should pin this post into the body of the article – good advice JJ!

  • Yorkie Aid says:

    1 Oct1 October 16:13

    Thank you jj. This is fantastic advice.

  • Rob says:

    1 Oct1 October 16:13

    Magnificent post

  • Josh says:

    1 Oct1 October 16:15

    Would love someone to template this into an email for us all to send out!

    • JJ says:

      3 Oct3 October 01:13

      Really???

  • the_real_a says:

    1 Oct1 October 16:22

    Its great advice – the problem for people will be to quantify and prove £ amounts for these losses.

    We know that the FOS cannot and will not force a finance company to provide non-monetary compensation (unless in the voluntary mediation stage, and the finance company offers points as a voluntary resolution). So all quantification should be in £ amounts with supporting evidence.

    • Michael Jennings says:

      1 Oct1 October 21:05

      I just want the annual fee back, personally.

  • Anna says:

    1 Oct1 October 16:30

    This is great, thanks. Can customers also expect to be given fair warning of any breaches of Ts & Cs they may have inadvertently committed (yes I know everyone should read them, but still), and also to be provided with a reason for the card closure? Just wondering if the lack of detail and withdrawal of benefits at short notice in the notification would go against Creation?

    • ankomonkey says:

      1 Oct1 October 17:08

      And this would be what we can take to Curve when asking them for compensation for advertising behaviours that led to our Creation termination.

      It feels fitting that having double-dipped on Creation card use that we should double-dip on compensation claims 😉

    • jj says:

      1 Oct1 October 17:08

      Quite possibly, yes, Anna. Outcome 1 says, “Consumers can be confident they are dealing with firms where the fair treatment of customers is central to the corporate culture.” In that context, it is hard to reconcile the use of a technical breach to justify widespread, indiscriminate and unilateral closure of an important financial product such as a credit card.

      If you have a long-enough memory, you may recall that in 2016 the FCA warned banks that they should be very careful before using ‘derisking’ as a reason for closing current accounts. The rationale for that warning was drawn from principles and outcomes that I’ve mentioned and, while that finding was for a different financial product, read-across seems reasonable.

  • WTL says:

    1 Oct1 October 16:36

    Thank you!

    • Paul says:

      1 Oct1 October 16:43

      Now when should we send this out? If they don’t pro rata refund the card fee and issue the free night award prematurely for those that will have earned it- and likewise the FO will want us to give time an opportunity to do so, right?

  • john browell says:

    1 Oct1 October 16:44

    Thanks very much for the detail; I’m almost finished drafting my complaint letter.

    • Rob says:

      1 Oct1 October 16:49

      Looking forward to seeing what exactly you claim for John …

  • Lady London says:

    1 Oct1 October 19:10

    very, very nice JJ. Thank you.

  • Ken says:

    1 Oct1 October 20:13

    First 2 points reasonable then gets more ridiculous as it goes on.
    “you passed over the opportunity to earn a welcome bonus”.
    Absolutely zero chance of getting compensation on this.

    “ closure means you will fail to reach Spire status,”

    Again, close to nil chance of compensation.
    There are even previous cases (MBNA) with the claim that people left with insufficient time to spend & thus to gain upgrade voucher .
    Complaints not upheld.

    Some absolute dreamers on here.

    They absolutely should be refunding pro rate card fee though.

• NFH says:

  1 Oct1 October 16:03

  I have stopped using my Creation IHG Rewards black card because its blocking of Curve prevents me from using it with Apple Pay. I will be claiming a pro-rata refund of the £99 annual fee, not from 3rd December 2021, but from 9th September 2021 when Creation prevented me from using it with Apple Pay. I raised a complaint with Creation demanding this in mid-September. Hopefully I will be near the front of the very long queue of complaints.

  I have switched my main card, for non-Amex merchants, to Barclaycard Hilton HHonours, which had been dormant for 5 years. Although it’s not the best card, it is issued by reputable and experienced card issuer. I will then switch to the new Cornèrcard UK Miles & More card when it’s launched in Q4.

  • His Holyness says:

    1 Oct1 October 16:08

    Unless the M&M Cornercard has a fee of £400 or something, plus Creation style credit limits and VS-style credit recycling limits, I can’t see it happening.

  • Dave says:

    1 Oct1 October 16:11

    A relaunched Cornercard? Pull the other one…

    • NFH says:

      1 Oct1 October 16:14

      It’s definitely on its way in Q4. It was confirmed to me by a very reliable source.

  • TGLoyalty says:

    1 Oct1 October 16:16

    What makes you think a M&M card is coming in Q4?

  • Harrier25 says:

    1 Oct1 October 16:57

    What’s not to like about the Hilton Honors Visa @ NFH? It’s free, 2 points for every £1 spent and continued Gold Tier as along as you spend £10K per calendar year. It’s a fantastic card!

    • Alex says:

      1 Oct1 October 19:03

      Didn’t it switch to 1 point per GBP a couple of years back?

      • Peter K says:

        1 Oct1 October 19:45

        Nope still 2 points per £ spend.

• Dave says:

  1 Oct1 October 16:10

  Lots of talk of the FOS, not much talk of MCOL.

  What’s to stop us (after letter before action of course) going straight to MCOL for the annual fee refund and free night reimbursement?

  • NFH says:

    1 Oct1 October 16:17

    MCOL is a way of issuing a claim in the Small Claims track of the County Court. Courts do not usually make awards for distress and inconvenience, whereas the FOS does. You’re likely to get more money in total out of the FOS without having to take time off work to attend court, either in person or remotely.

  • EwanG says:

    1 Oct1 October 16:22

    FOS has no cost to the consumer.

    Been a long time since I did a small claims court action but I did look into MCOL recently for something else and came to the conclusion it’s still a more “legal” process and thus complicated, whereas FOS (and the alt dispute resolution such as CEDR) is consumer friendly!

  • Andrew (@andrewseftel) says:

    1 Oct1 October 16:27

    FOS can consider matters of fairness whereas MCOL would only consider matters of law.

    • NFH says:

      1 Oct1 October 16:41

      MCOL doesn’t consider anything. MCOL is a way of issuing a claim in the Small Claims track of the County Court. Courts will look only at financial loss suffered, whereas the FOS will also take poor service into account when determining an award for distress and inconvenience.

  • Dave says:

    1 Oct1 October 16:54

    I don’t care about distress, I care about the £99 fee I’ve paid and haven’t been refunded, I care about the night at Le grand that they owe me and will reimburse me for in cash.

    • meta says:

      1 Oct1 October 17:39

      Why not IC Maldives or IC Bora Bora?

      • Dave says:

        1 Oct1 October 17:51

        Slightly harder to pop there for a Saturday night on a weekend…

        • meta says:

          1 Oct1 October 18:23

          But you can tag along any number of nights using points that you earned from IHG spending…doesn’t need to be just a weekend.

    • Anna says:

      1 Oct1 October 18:47

      Kimpton Seafire at peak time when it’s £1000 per night!

• Mark Ingall says:

  1 Oct1 October 16:14

  What is IHGs reaction to this ? Presumably they received some benefit from the Creation arrangement, as they did with Barclays before Creation. But with the black card no longer available and others being cancelled, somewhat less of a benefit. How long does the contract between IHG and creation last ……… and who might replace Creation with this offer and link to IHG?

  • TGLoyalty says:

    1 Oct1 October 16:18

    They’re about to sell creation 90m or so fewer points a year I reckon …

• Paul says:

  1 Oct1 October 16:33

  Suggest all who can lodge a complaint – Creation customer care contacted and they won’t even confirm why the card is to be cancelled other than saying it’s a business decision. I don’t even really use my IHG through curve? They will take a complaint by phone – took me over an hour to get through as per their wonderful service. Reviews on trust-pilot may be in order too!

  • Richard says:

    2 Oct2 October 07:07

    It’s a long time since I worked in retail banking but it seems a bit odd if they insist on a phone call to log a complaint. We were always told that a complaint is any expression of dissatisfaction however expressed, so we could not insist that someone called a particular number or put something in writing — if they expressed their dissatisfaction in any way though any channel that should be considered, and handled, as a complaint. If they have directed you away from (say) live chat to the call centre because they don’t accept complaints through live chat, I’d be adding that to my complaint too.

• gt94sss2 says:

  1 Oct1 October 16:41

  I’ve also been notified that Creation are closing one of my 3 Creation cards – the one I use on a daily basis with Curve until the other week.

  It’s Creation branded one, not a hotel points based one :/

  I use it for almost everything from shopping to PayPal.. largely as Creation don’t support Google Play.

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