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The HfP chat thread – Sunday 12th September

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Comments (494)

This article is closed to new posts. Discussion continues in the HfP Forums.

  • Mco says:
    12 Sep12 September 12:22

    Anyone found any good roaming deals on EE? I need around 30GB a month. Thought about staying with three but fancy a eSim.

    • Ls says:
      12 Sep12 September 12:48

      Yes, if you go for their posh SIMs with smart benefits, you can select the EU traveller to avoid paying £2/day. You use your U.K. allowance, so make sure it is at least 30 GB. Ee also very good for far flung places. Roaming minutes are pre-purchased, as is data, so you are unlikely to accidentally go over.

    • David says:
      12 Sep12 September 13:45

      EE has a terrible signal, why put yourself through that misery.

      • StillintheSun says:
        12 Sep12 September 15:20

        After over 20 years I left Orange/EE for O2. 25GB and unlimited calls with EC roaming for £17 a month. A few quid more for 30GB. Required a couple of calls to get roaming sorted post-porting which could have been more seamless but overall satisfied. I was minded to punish EE for introducing roaming charges so quickly after their false promises. I’m an actions should have consequences kinda guy 🙂

      • Optimus Prime says:
        12 Sep12 September 15:21

        Depends on where you live and work. It has the best signal and speed in Canary Wharf

      • bafan says:
        12 Sep12 September 15:22

        I read somewhere they had the best in the UK?!

        • David says:
          12 Sep12 September 18:49

          So their marketing says…our work phones are on them, my partner’s business phone is with them. We get no signal at home (fine on o2, Vodafone and in no way a rural location), constant complaints from colleagues at work of same or very intermittent signal, missed calls, messages etc. Decision thankfully made to move corporate contract to Vodafone, due in a couple of months, can’t wait.

  • John says:
    12 Sep12 September 12:31

    Love the name of the chief executive of the Night Time Industries Association applauding passports U-turn (in England, but not rest of UK).

    Also, “the announcement came shortly after the minister had appeared on Sky News and told host Trevor Phillips a final decision had yet to be made. He said: ‘We haven’t made a final decision as a government.'”

    https://www.rte.ie/news/2021/0912/1246131-england-covid19/

    • Jeff Greene says:
      12 Sep12 September 14:35

      There was a good tweet about Sacha Lord claiming to be a man of the people and the industry but then charging £12 for a drink. He didn’t take it well 😂

  • Tom says:
    12 Sep12 September 13:03

    Another day another pointless card blocking by Creation from a recurring £5 curve payment I forgot to change to another card. Oh and the best bit is you can’t unblock it until tomorrow because their security team aren’t 24/7. Other cards allow you to unblock via automated phone line or app but it seems they are still stuck in the 1990s.

    • Duncan Stevenson-Price says:
      12 Sep12 September 13:22

      I really wish IHG would ditch Creation and move to a competent issuer. They’re a bit of a joke.

      • Doug M says:
        12 Sep12 September 15:16

        Who’ll step in? Companies running hotel/airline cards are hardly queuing up to take over. Hilton did that survey but no new card appeared, the M&M card went and wasn’t replaced despite the initial optimism.

        • Rob says:
          12 Sep12 September 15:25

          When IHG launched this card, they asked a number of card companies to bid and ONLY Creation even bothered to submit an offer.

          Oddly I think they might get more joy today. At that time, the card companies were used to their ludicrous profit margins, pre interchange caps, and didn’t see any way of making a lot of money on this card in a post interchange world. By now most have wised up that credit cards will NEVER be a licence to print money ever again and are recalibrating expectations. Klarna etc is also destroying the credit card market for the under 30s which means a card aimed at middle aged business travellers looks even more promising.

          There are also nimbler companies out there who can make money more easily.

          Capital On Tap has 160 employees on LinkedIn. Barclaycard has 5,000. One of these two businesses is not correctly staffed for the modern credit card world.

          • Jimmy says:
            12 Sep12 September 18:32

            Do we think that leaving the EU might prompt a review of the interfchange fee cap?

            We can then go back to the good days.

          • Rob says:
            12 Sep12 September 20:44

            Because nothing wins votes more than putting up shop prices for the public in order to directly enrich two huge American financial companies?

          • Anna says:
            12 Sep12 September 19:45

            Klarna don’t accept Amex (or possibly vice versa)!

          • Jimmy says:
            12 Sep12 September 21:09

            Not sure there was need for sarcasm rob>? Genuine question.

            1). Did shop prices go down after the cap? Not as far as I can see.
            2) Have the tories ever lobbied the EU for better rights for the financial sector? Yes, they have.

          • Rob says:
            12 Sep12 September 22:33

            1. I suggest you read a couple of articles on ‘menu costs’ and its role in New Keynesian economic and pricing theory

            2. Interchange fee cap was driven by the U.K. Government

        • Harrier25 says:
          12 Sep12 September 17:32

          Selfishly, I don’t want a new Hilton credit card because I’m very happy with my Barclaycard Hilton Honors Visa. I’m sure that any new card won’t be as attractive.

      • Harrier25 says:
        12 Sep12 September 17:26

        I think IHG and Creation are very well suited cos they’re both a joke!

    • TGLoyalty says:
      12 Sep12 September 13:40

      Erm Creation have blocked curve full stop …

    • Doug M says:
      12 Sep12 September 15:11

      Creation have blocked use through Curve, who knew?

  • Save East Coast Rewards says:
    12 Sep12 September 13:07

    I’ve been driving for the last 5 hours but I have now had a chance to read the replies to my post on the Italian green pass (page 1). It’s good to hear the arguments for and against so thanks for sharing your opinions and despite my lack of interaction in the comments I’ve read them all

  • Bob Short says:
    12 Sep12 September 13:20

    Seeking confirmation of my thinking here please, membership year ends May 8th. Contemplating Biz trip to LA Mar which should, along with a return flight to EDI get me to silver. Will that then keep me silver until May 23, or just for a further 2 months….?

    • Jonathan says:
      12 Sep12 September 17:00

      You would be Silver till 30th June 23 then soft land to Bronze till 30th June ‘24 assuming didn’t requalify for Silver.

  • FM says:
    12 Sep12 September 14:40

    Looking to use the Amex Platinum dining credit at the Duck & Waffle – online booking platform is requesting a £20 per person deposit – the processor seems to be Sevenrooms. Does anyone know if the resulting transaction is likely to be valid for the amex offer?

  • bafan says:
    12 Sep12 September 14:52

    AMEX US has a 40% transfer bonus to BAEC. Worth moving some, right?

  • r* says:
    12 Sep12 September 14:54

    Finally got to a service agent on BA chatbot. Flight booked in dec 20, flight due in oct 21, agent refused to move it to july 2022 as its over 12 months from the original ticketing date. Said BAs policy to move to 12 months of flight date was revoked a cpl of weeks ago.

    What should be the next step, LBA or is there anything else I can try first?

    • Lady London says:
      12 Sep12 September 15:48

      I’d LBA and not waste time. Give them 14 days in the LBA to provide your flights or you will take legal action for the cash cost of replacement flights on a different airline. Actually give them 21 days but on Day 21 file for retail price of the average of 3 quotes which you enclose as evidence of market cost (ideally each from different website or agent/OTA).

      Ensure the quotes are for tickets with equivalent (or close) flexibility. To encourage them about the likely cash this will cost them, ensure that the airline code of the flight on the first leg (at least) of each of the three ticket costs you present as examples, is **not** :-

      not a BA flight
      not a OneWorld flight
      not a QR flight
      If poss, not an LH group flight (so not LH, LX, Brussels Airlines, LO, AG)
      not Aer Lingus
      *****
      If possible make sure at least the first leg is:
      If poss, Virgin or Skyteam flight
      Star Alliance other than LH Group

      It could help to give them one more call before the LBA and say I need to get your final answer before I send BA a Letter Before Action so can you please take another look at my ticket and these are the flights I would like”

      • Lady London says:
        12 Sep12 September 16:33

        do not mention how you chose which other airlines’ flights you chose to quote though. If asked at some point, and only if asked, you can mention your lack of appetite to fly on BA or indeed any OneWorld airline given this experience.

        First flight airline code matters because that’s who “owns” the ticket, and gets all the money, and only hands out the very considerably lower interline rates to the airlines whose codes are on all following flights. You can conceivably have a ticket where only the first flight code out of, say 8 flights is airline 1, all the following 7 flights are airline 2, and airline 1 is keeping most of the money cost of the ticket.

        Obvs try to ensure BA and its friends haven’t got a codeshare available on the first outgoing flight you pick on any of your 3 quotes.

        • Jonathan says:
          12 Sep12 September 17:22

          I’d play this differently tbh. I’d LBA stating the exact BA flights I wanted then if they refuse buy fully flexible on BA & MCOL for cost.

          Reasons are;

          1) if BA or the judge make an issue about the reasonableness of your actions in claiming £20k for 241/Avios/cheap tickets worth £1500 max then you can point out there is no cost to BA as refunding you results in no net cash leaving BA.

          2) BA will be more likely to pay up without a fight when the settlement results in no outflow of cash. I’ve had 2 prompt payouts in this scenario from 2019 strikes & Feb 2020 weather.

          3) Spending £20k on BA flights will earn me 60k Avios + a 241 on BAPP plus another minimum 40k Avios for 2 flex longhaul J tickets & a good chunk of Tier Points. My relationship with BA is transactional not emotional. 100k bonus Avios is a better outcome for me than some M&M/KLM miles I won’t use. Bloodying BA’s nose is irrelevant.

          • ChrisC says:
            12 Sep12 September 17:41

            Seriously?

            How many people can afford to have £20k tied up for a lengthy period of time.

          • r* says:
            12 Sep12 September 17:51

            Once it has gone to MCOL, do BA have to then either pay up before it gets to the judge or pay up when the judge orders them to, presumably they cant just then agree to move the original flights and then provide that to the judge as complying?

            It would be more likely for them to payup before it gets as far as the judge if it was booked on a BA/OW flex?

            Theres one complicating factor, it was a split ticket with the outbound leg going to a country that BA no longer operate to, so it wouldnt be possible to book a BA ticket for that leg.

            Given that, would it be acceptable to book the outbound to japan as well (ie not the same country as where the original ticket was booked to) or would that be a bad thing as it would no longer be considered like for like so less likely to win mcol?

            The other option is given that the outbound and inbound are on 2 different PNR, can I just claim for the inbound even tho theyre both on the same 241? I have an alternative option for the outbound next year, so I only really need the inbound to be moved.

          • Jonathan says:
            12 Sep12 September 21:36

            To ChrisC, it wasn’t lengthy in my 2 cases at all. Cheque received within a fortnight of claim going in, didn’t get anywhere near a judge. May well take longer at the moment but I’d liquidate my non ISA savings to cover this as it’s a safe bet with a great return. Failing that use the cheapest credit source you have access to & stick it on the MCOL bill (put 3 months estimated interest on the claim form).

          • Jonathan says:
            12 Sep12 September 21:50

            To r*, BA would either pay up promptly or “on the court steps”. MCOL is for financial remedy so they’d have to pay you if it went to court. What you agree pre trial is up to you so you could accept a rebooking to withdraw claim. It’s academic to them anyway & the reason you book flexible is so you always have a bail out option.

            I imagine your route is Seoul with return from Tokyo? Should be able to get BA codeshares on Cathay or JAL via HKG or TYO on outbound.

            Sticking with BA/OW is reasonable behaviour in that it keeps cost to a minimum. It’s an accounting exercise for BA rather than a large cash outgoing. Behaving reasonably is a fundamental principle of civil litigation. Would booking ANA stop you winning? No, but it might make a judge more likely to go through your claim with a fine tooth comb.

          • Lady London says:
            13 Sep13 September 00:12

            You’re clearly far too nice Jonathan! I think you’ve missed my point. I hope r* grts it.

            It’s different ways of going about what you say in 2) above Jonathan. You and I both want the same. Which is for BA to stop these silly (and actually not legal) rejections of ticket rerouting dates r* is entitled to under EU261.

            All 3 of us (you, me and r*) just want BA to issue or reissue r*’s ticket for travel on the later dates convenient to r*.

            My way of encouraging BA to decide it would be much better to provide the dates r* wants, is to let them know that reasonable fair equivalent alternative travel that gives r* nothing his BA ticket (and its EU261 rerouting rights) didn’t give r*. If it gets to court BA will know given these proposals are equivalent and fair (3 different proposals from 3 different websites or agencies ideally on 3 different airlines ie show a fair look at what’s available in the market) the judge is likely to accept them as a fair market cost and BA runs the risk of having to pay actual cash for one of them or their average.

            We know the one thing BA really, really needs to conserve is cash. Any lawyer in BA that lets BA get near court with this instead of settling…well that would be the intern. The cash cost is not intended to be recovered it’s a frightener.

            Selecting airlines that BA doesn’t have lower-cost agreements with means there’s no way BA can reduce the cash cost figure if one of those options is awarded by the court or used as the base for a financial award. This will hopefully encourage BA further that they don’t want to go to court even if they think they can wriggle out of EU261 because if they’re wrong and they lose, the cash cost they would have to pay is higher.

            Jonathan you shouted over the fence to BA “Can I have my ball back?” I sent my pet Doberman over the fence to retrieve it.

          • Lady London says:
            13 Sep13 September 01:05

            My get 3 quotes suggestion – or just do it yourself on the internet – is to avoid you having to make a booking to claim. So no cash out of pocket.

            I did use to suggest finding a friendly travel agent who would hold a booking that you could cancel but people were having difficulty finding agents that would do this. Hence my new approach above of proving market costs for the same travel, similar to the way a lot of different types of cost are often asked to be proved to be reasonable. I think ChrisC may have missed the change in my approach too.

        • r* says:
          12 Sep12 September 17:41

          Thanks, ANA sounds a nice option thats not linked to BA at all afaik.

          How long does it usually take for a resolution on mcol?

          Its complicated slightly by the 2for1 that the flight is booked on is due to expire next month. Given that its an avios booking, I’d be booking the replacement ANA flight as fully refundable, so long as MCOL went against BA, are BA then required to basically send the money for the replacement booking? (do I actually need to make the booking or is sending the details of the other booking enough?)

          Is there anything that would then stop me from cancelling the fully flex cash ticket and rebooking it as the cheaper non-flex booking?

          • Lady London says:
            13 Sep13 September 00:42

            OK r* now added a new reply and explanation above, but also seen the detail you’ve provided about your trip.

            If BA is no longer flying your outward route this is wonderful news. Basically it means that if you insist on your rerouting rights, BA has no choice but to ticket you on another airline. Hence they would really like you to take a refund or FTV to get them off that cost hook.

            This means once they understand they are going to have to provide you a ticket on another airline because you know your rights and will pursue them, they will be very, very focused on reducing that cost and booking you on one of their friends that flies that route. Or to another place BA can get you to compromise on. Excellent.

            So the tactic is to get BA to recognise that you really will pursue this. And that it is better for them to be accommodating. As that way they will get to keep more cash.

            So you can follow as Jonathan and I have suggested (choose how nice you want to be) or just call them at 8am and tell them your wishes again for new date.

            When they refuse tell them you’ve been on HeadforPoints with Jonathan and Lady London who are suggesting formal legal action due to EU261 having no limit on date for your rebooking rights. But really as this would be timeconsuming for you and costly for them if you, for instance, do the trip on ANA you’d really like to see if you can agree a better solution first.

            Mention you understand it could be a problem for then as they’re no longer flying to Korea and, whilst you’d still prefer Korea, as you know it could be difficult for them you’d be prepared to consider going to Japan instead as a reroute on the dates convenient to you. See what they can do.

            Basically if you get a competent agent that knows EU261 they should bite your hand off and give you your dates. If not their lawyers will tell them to when they see your Letter before Action. Be very careful to only ‘discuss’ or ‘consider ‘ and not ‘propose’ or ‘accept’ until they agree what you want.

            Let us know what happens I would expect this to resolve quite quickly.

          • Lady London says:
            13 Sep13 September 01:15

            PS r* don’t be anxious about the validity of the 241 if BA cancelled a flight on your booking they still have to honour the 241 for your rerouted date. Same as even if a sale you bought a 50% avios ticket or a discounted ticket is long ago ended, once BA cancels a flight on your booking they can’r insist on avios seats being available and they can’t insist on any more avios or cash for the rerouted date.

    • Amy C says:
      12 Sep12 September 16:38

      In same boat as you, what’s LBA?

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