The HfP chat thread – Sunday 4th July

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• Njb says:

  4 Jul4 July 11:07

  As I continue to channel my effort into planning my London/Wimbledon trip I found this:
  https://cardmemberlounge.com/resources/CML_Menu.pdf
  Amex lounge menu if anyone is interested. Coffee is cheaper than the cafes at Sandbanks but not the champagne!
  Looking for a nice outdoor table place to eat in London on Thursday night – can see its still amex restaurant month bookable through open table. ££ rather than ££. Any recommendations? We are at the Conrad.
  Thanks

  • Sam says:

    4 Jul4 July 12:29

    What is Amex Restaurant month?
    The Ivy Victoria is a good shout – they have outside tables.

    • Njb says:

      4 Jul4 July 13:04

      https://londonrestaurantfestivalsummer.com/festival_menus/

      Maybe didn’t describe it properly

• Vin says:

  4 Jul4 July 11:39

  I have a return trip in F on BA at end July. F is no longer available on that route and I’ve been assigned to J on a different flight. As my schedule involves some cancelled flights, I am able to rebook at my convenience (which actually works out fine).
  However, if I do accept flights on another date in J do I lose my right to claim 75% of the fare back for the involuntary downgrade from F ?

  • AJA says:

    4 Jul4 July 12:57

    I’d say so as you aren’t flying on the original flights you booked. The downgrade “compensation” is when you aren’t able to be seated where you booked. It’s a refund of fare paid. It assumes ordinarily that the F cabin is still on the aircraft but a replacement aircraft without F cabin does not absolve the airline from paying the refund as that is an operational issue and choice by the airline not to operate a like-for-like replacement aircraft.

    If you voluntarily move to other flights, especially ones that don’t have the F cabin you are choosing to do so. And relinquish the right to refund in doing so.

    A better option might be to request re-route on a plane with an F cabin, as is also your right; a flight with comparable conditions.

    • Vin says:

      4 Jul4 July 15:38

      Thank you for taking the time to respond @AJA.
      I will have to move the flights to another month as the country I intend to visit is on our red list, which I’ll be able to do as BA cancelled some of the original flights. It looks like I won’t be able to claim the downgrade compo though.

    • Jonathan says:

      4 Jul4 July 17:05

      You don’t have the legal right to reroute in original class of travel, that’s at airlines discretion/goodwill.

      • AJA says:

        4 Jul4 July 17:49

        @ Jonathan Are you sure you don’t have the legal right to reroute in original class of travel?

        EC261/2004 states the following:
        Article 8 Right to reimbursement or re-routing
        (b) re-routing, under comparable transport conditions, to their final destination at the earliest opportunity; or
        (c) re-routing, under comparable transport conditions, to their final destination at a later date at the passenger’s convenience, subject to availability of seats.

        I read that as saying if there is a flight on sale at a later date with F availability to purchase you should be able to request rerouting onto that flight as a seat in J is not comparable with a seat in F. BA will throw in the booking class saying A class is not the same as F class or reward seats book into a different class and require availability on the future flight but that is not stated under EC261. Also if BA is arguing that way I would argue the same and say a seat in J is not the same as a seat in F and they also earn different Tier Points. BA can’t have it both ways.

        • AJA says:

          4 Jul4 July 23:27

          @Vin I would check what cash prices are for J on BA on your preferred dates of travel. You might find it easier and cheaper simply to go for full refund of what you’ve paid and then rebook at your convenience. If prices are higher than you’ve paid just accept the reroute on your preferred date in J. Or cancel for an FTV and then rebook.

          It is also possible that BA may just reinstate F on the route. If that is the case then I’d make a case for just accepting the reroute in J but make it clear to BA that you want to be reinstated in F if it becomes available. Keep all records and notes of conversations you have with BA.

      • Lady London says:

        4 Jul4 July 18:39

        you have the right to travel in comparable conditions and this has been being interpreted at MCOL as meaning same cabin class as booked, then some other things can additionally be required to fulfil the requirement of conparable conditions

        If I was the OP I would rebook another date exact same travel, keep asking for First and maintain clarity that if I am being forced to accept J rather than the F I booked then this involuntary. If any more clarity was needed I would also mention that after the flight I would expect to claim the statutory reimbursement for involuntary downgrade.

        Rinse and Repeat all of the above for any subsequent airline cancellations on same booking.

        • Vin says:

          4 Jul4 July 19:05

          Thank you again @AJA and @LadyLondon.
          I’m a situation where F has been culled by BA for the forseeable future (to BOM) so this cabin is not available even on later dates. My preference would be to fly direct on BA rather than re-route via another country with a different airline offering F as one cannot predict what Covid travel restrictions may continue to apply.
          Hence the reason to use BA but what they can now offer me is J and not F.
          I suppose I’ll have to ring them to see what they say – which is probably no 🙂

• Matt B says:

  4 Jul4 July 11:47

  I was just about to book a reward flight to the Balearics and when selecting class it gives the option of First? (The plane is given as an a320). Is this likely to be a mistake or could they be changing to a long haul jet? I’ve flown the MAD-LHR in the CW setup before but even then I don’t think they ever sold the F cabin?

  • Anna says:

    4 Jul4 July 12:00

    BA may well be putting on larger aircraft because of increased demand with the Balearics currently being green, but you might just get CE service like with the MAD flight. We’ve been seated in the F cabin on a long haul flight which doesn’t usually offer F and got CW service, although it was obviously a very comfortable way to spend 12 hours!
    It would be interesting to know if you would get F lounge access, is the avios price being charged higher than for CE as if that was the case I would definitely expect F lounge access.

    • Matt B says:

      4 Jul4 July 12:23

      It did let me select F at a higher avios cost than CE but it kicked me out on the next screen and now it seems to have disappeared so likely just an IT quirk.

      • Jonathan says:

        4 Jul4 July 17:07

        It’s a known IT issue where (App most commonly) shows travel classes that aren’t available. Usually if you’ve done multiple searches or scrolled through different dates.

• Tomgold says:

  4 Jul4 July 12:07

  my flight to Lyon with BA booked with Avios for 15 July has been changed to the 16th without BA contacting me in advance.
  flying on the 16th doesn’t work for me but there aren’t really many alternatives as BA have cancelled (almost) all the other flights.
  what rights do I have i.e. what can I ask from BA if they’ve completely screwed up my travel plans?

  • Sam G says:

    4 Jul4 July 12:27

    there aren’t really any good options on the 15th on any airline. BA can rebook you to Geneva including on a Swiss flight if you can make that work?

• meta says:

  4 Jul4 July 12:13

  How did you find out if they didn’t contact you? In any case duty of care applies so any extra costs BA should pick up and that includes accommodation cancellation, repricing, etc. You can also ask for a re-route on 15th. Are there indirect routes with Air France or via Brussels, Frankfurt, etc? For the latter you might have to book on your own and make a claim via MCOL as BA will not do it initially, but you’ll most certainly win at MCOL.

  • Nick says:

    4 Jul4 July 14:22

    BA are able to book on LX and LH. Plenty of examples where they’ve done so within Europe without any fight at all.

  • Tomgold says:

    5 Jul5 July 01:53

    after changing my flight to the following day, they notified me of the change, I meant I wasn’t given any options.
    if i choose a re-route, are they obligated to do so?
    I have a deal for a 4 week car rental at Lyon which I won’t get anywhere else at this point, so I’ll lose out significantly if I change to Geneva

• Ian says:

  4 Jul4 July 12:19

  Hello all, I know that this has been answered a million times in the comments – if anyone can direct me to a day of comments to look at I will do so gladly. I want to ask BA to reroute my cancelled flights for a date that is more than 12 months from the date of my original booking. My understanding is that BA will likely tell me to get stuffed as their rule is 12 months, but that in law there is no such 12 month rule and they should accommodate my request. Is there anything specific I can put to them when I call You First or is my only option to rebook myself then hope I can claim back from BA?

  • AJA says:

    4 Jul4 July 13:05

    The best option is to try moving your flights via MMB yourself first. Sometimes it allows you to select flights beyond 12 months.

    If not then phone YouFirst and have a very good reason for moving beyond 12 months, eg I can only travel on x date due to employer restrictions on when holidays can be granted. The latter may not work although the regulations state rebooting at later date at the convenience of the passenger.

    Is this a reward booking or a cash one? You might find BA more amenable if it’s cash. Another option is to take a FTV and rebook the dates you want if there are F seats available.

    • Ian says:

      4 Jul4 July 13:25

      Unfortunately it is a reward booking (First Class Return for 2 London – Sydney booked with the 50% offer). Taking the FTV will mean missing out on the 50% offer. I called You First and they were pretty firm that I need to book within the validity period (by 4th November). BA are only scheduling to Sydney from 1st November and I would doubt it’ll be open to tourists by then and at any rate all the first class cabins are full on the 1st 2nd and 3rd. Will probably just have to give up, but would have ideally liked to have booked in for Feb. It does seem a bit odd that BA would rather give me a full refund than let me exchange- 12 month rule seems a bit arbitrary to me, but I’m sure they have their reasons.

      • Ian says:

        4 Jul4 July 13:27

        Also- did try to do it on the website, but it didn’t give the option to rebook. Just had a link that said please contact us.

        • meta says:

          4 Jul4 July 14:20

          There is very little chance you will be able to go to Australia this or next year as they won’t allow tourists until situation has stabilised globally and Australia hasn’t vaccinated much either.

        • Lady London says:

          4 Jul4 July 18:50

          I’d take whatever is nearest date in same cabin.Check first to see which dates have cash tickets selling your cabin. If a cash seat is available you have a right to it if BA cancelled your original flight. You are not restricted to avios seats to rebook into even if your booking was an avios one.

          Spin the dice again when and if what you take gets cancelled. What you have booked is a once in a lifetime opportunity to get so I would hold on a bit longer and spin the dice again

        • Lady London says:

          4 Jul4 July 18:54

          PS if you have to take J as late as they are offering to keep the booking alive and play again, make sure you keep clear to them you’re only accepting J as forced to – as in words I mentioned to the other poster today

      • Memesweeper says:

        4 Jul4 July 14:19

        You could be in for a long fight on this Ian but you should expect to prevail. You are entitled to rerouting, in F, at a future date. Try online again in a week, try calling a few more times. Make notes of the dates, times and who you spoke to. Plenty of people have managed to rebook beyond 12 months, including me. I was very persistent. If you are met with a flat refusal and mention of the 12 month rule then you may need to resort to a letter before action and a threat to take BA to court for the cost of the cash fares for the dates you are interested in. The cheapest refundable fares are, I think, select plus, which is only available through some travel agents. Try Amex Travel to get your price.

        • Harry T says:

          4 Jul4 July 15:28

          I had a go at getting them to move my flights past ticket validity but was flatly refused. Others have had better luck. Do it online if you can. Personally couldn’t be bothered with a legal battle as I didn’t consider it worth my time or the stress involved. Only you can decide how far you want to take it. I agree that entering Australia for tourism is a very long way off.

        • Jonathan says:

          4 Jul4 July 17:23

          I’d suck this one up I’m afraid. Too much uncertainty over when Aus will allow tourists in but in all likelihood it’ll be a long time yet. High chance you’d be faced with further cancellations or winning a Pyrrhic victory where you get a new booking that you can’t then travel on.

          BA may well argue (& win) at MCOL that rerouting is not a suitable settlement for a holiday to a destination that has no imminent timeframe for admitting tourists.

• @mkcol says:

  4 Jul4 July 12:23

  Data Point: Had 2 future travel vouchers from June & October 2020 trips which were cancelled last year.

  Took 5 mins to get through to Newcastle this afternoon & they are able to refund the vouchers (Avios & cash) back as they have greater flexibility.

  Surprised there was that flexibility (now) and that it took so little time to get through.

  • Anna says:

    4 Jul4 July 15:30

    Did they say what would happen with a companion voucher tied up in a FTV?

    • @mkcol says:

      4 Jul4 July 23:58

      Neither of my FTVs had one so I don’t know per se, however she did mention that it was easier to do because there wasn’t one.

      Avios back in the correct accounts by the evening when I next checked.

      Impressed.

• Aston100 says:

  4 Jul4 July 13:01

  I see Igloo energy are putting their price up by 12% or more.
  Is anyone here considering leaving them? if so, to whom?
  Igloo seem to have the ability to overpay using Amex, which may have been a factor for choosing them.

  • TGLoyalty says:

    4 Jul4 July 13:03

    Are Octopus competitive where you are? If so they accept Amex

    Let me know if you need a referral

    • Aston100 says:

      4 Jul4 July 13:34

      Thanks but their quote is higher than Igloo, post Igloo price hike.
      For me anyway.

      Looks like PFP are the cheapest at present, but I’ve never heard of them prior to last week.

      • Nick says:

        4 Jul4 July 14:25

        It’s such a heavily regulated market that I don’t have any issue signing up with small players. Biggest risk is that they go bust, but even then it’s more an inconvenience than anything as accounts will be migrated and any funds safe. MSE has a comparison checker for your local best offers. You can put in fake details if you don’t want them to spam you.

        • Aston100 says:

          4 Jul4 July 16:16

          Thanks Nick. Have gone with PFP.
          I know someone here gave a referral code for them last week, but the sneaky buggers remove the cheapest tariff if you use a code.

  • Nigel W says:

    5 Jul5 July 10:44

    Don’t think they allow Amex to overpay, but maybe worth trying British Gas Evolve.cheaper than BG as it is all online only.

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