The HfP chat thread – Thursday 10th June

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jek says:

10 Jun10 June 12:23

Who is responsible for flight changes under EU261, the airline (here Delta) or the ticketer (Virgin Atlantic)? I am being bounced between them, Virgin says only Delta can do such changes and Delta says only Virgin can do the changes.

Background: I have award flights LHR-MSP on Delta which have been cancelled. I want to move the dates, but that route has no award seats (open to Virgin) any longer at all. Thus Virgin cannot change it and Delta says it cannot change Virgin tickets.
- Rhys says:
  
  10 Jun10 June 12:45
  
  Technically I believe it is the operating carrier. In practise, it can get complicated as above.
  - AJA says:
    
    10 Jun10 June 13:58
    
    Isn’t the point of a codeshare that for all intents and purposes you are travelling on the airline that issued the ticket regardless of the actual metal? This is why they make the announcements on board mentioning the codesharing airlines. So for the purposes of a cancellation you should be able to get the ticket issuer (Virgin) to re-ticket you.
    
    Alternatively Delta is the operating carrier that has cancelled it’s UK departing flight and is therefore bound by UK261, which is the UK equivalent of EU261, and therefore must offer re-routing assistance.
- Lady London says:
  
  10 Jun10 June 12:52
  
  best to address both in any correspondence (and keep records of requests made to each or both).
  
  If they keep this rubbish up then either wait 8 weeks or ask each to confirm their final answer/they refuse to deal with it then send them as joint addressees your Letter Before Action then MCOL them both together as defendants in your MCOL submission and let the court sort out who’s liable.
- Sam G says:
  
  10 Jun10 June 14:27
  
  try get Delta to add the new flights to the reservation and then ask Virgin to ticket it or ask Virgin to speak to some kind of Delta liaison to get the space open or find out how to force it. I’m not familiar with Virgin/Delta but on BA you’d ask them to speak to the oneworld desk and they’d liaise with the relevant airline/rev man and try get it sorted.
  
  Other option is to try get rerouted somewhere on Virgin metal
  - Sam G says:
    
    10 Jun10 June 14:28
    
    @AJA also makes a good point – is this DL code or VS code? Is there a VS code on your preferred flight option? Quoting the VS flight number of your preferred flight may help
- Phil W says:
  
  10 Jun10 June 19:01
  
  Your contract is with Virgin. They need to sort either themselves or instruct Delta.
- jek says:
  
  10 Jun10 June 19:20
  
  In the end Delta did not allow rebooking to a date of my convenience and only allowed to change it by +/- one day. I will not go down the MCOL route as Delta as non-EU airline is not bound to do anything for the return flight as I understand the regulation that outbound and return are always considered as two separate flights).
  - Lady London says:
    
    11 Jun11 June 00:34
    
    non-EU airline is liable to EU261 if departing UK/Europe
    - jek says:
      
      11 Jun11 June 09:21
      
      I read the following on the EU’s page on passenger rights:
      
      The outbound and return flights are always considered as two separate flights even if they were booked as part of one reservation. In some cases the airline operating the flight (also known as the operating air carrier) may not be the same as the one from which you bought your ticket. In case of any difficulties only the airline which operates the flight can be held responsible.
      
      My interpretation is that only Delta is responsible in the end and that Delta is not required to rebook the returning flight as non-EU/UK carrier for a non-EU/UK originating flight.
- Lady London says:
  
  11 Jun11 June 00:30
  
  legally if they cancelled t
  your flight you are entitled to any available seat being sold in same cabin. EU261 states this specifically airline is not allowed to insist on award seat availability to reroute you.
  
  .
bafan says:

10 Jun10 June 12:24

Maybe too niche but has anyone ever done the boat from Aberdeen to Lerwick? Thoughts? Loganair is so expensive (yes £365 return from London is expensive for some of us 😉).
- Paul says:
  
  10 Jun10 June 12:29
  
  Yes it’s great. Especially if you like boats.
  - Dave says:
    
    10 Jun10 June 12:36
    
    Especially long and rough voyages
- Vit says:
  
  10 Jun10 June 12:51
  
  Did it back in September 2012. It was a long overnight journey but there were quite a few of us so it was all good fun. Weather was not bad but “cradling” enough for a good night sleep! Both ferries are the same length (>100m) if I am not wrong so long enough to ride out the wave-crest so you should be fine even you don’t have your sea-legs during the bad weather. Enjoy! 🙂
- Michael C says:
  
  10 Jun10 June 13:51
  
  I agree with you about Loganair: IOM-LHR-IOM currently GBP240 return!
  - Lord Doncaster says:
    
    10 Jun10 June 14:00
    
    But you do get a tunnocks wafer 😂 Or has that been enhanced?
    - tony says:
      
      10 Jun10 June 16:21
      
      Loganair have suspended all cabin service, because of The COVID, innit….
      
      (data point was a flight I took at the start of the week)
      
      In another genius move, to preserve social distancing, LM now block out all the D seats on the E-145 seat map, which forced my son and I to book seats in consecutive rows. Check in then assigned someone the blocked seat next to my son in row 3 because she “didn’t want to sit any further back”. The plane was 1/3rd full, FFS.
      
      Despite saying how safe flying is, if airlines are then going to make cretinous plays like this, the mess we’re in isn’t going anywhere fast. I’d genuinely expected more from LM on both the above situations.
- MKB says:
  
  10 Jun10 June 14:41
  
  Lewis Goodall, the BBC Newsnight Political Editor, did it a few weeks ago and covered it on his Twitter account: https://twitter.com/lewis_goodall
  He posts a lot, unsurprisingly, so it may take a while to find it.
- bafan says:
  
  10 Jun10 June 21:04
  
  Thank you for the thoughts! More popular than I thought. I’ll have a look through that Twitter now. +1 @ Michael C – ludicrous pricing for 45 minute flights.
David says:

10 Jun10 June 12:32

Does anyone know the UK phone number for Marriott Bonvoy customer services? Their website is completely useless and all the numbers I try either don’t work or are for a fax…
- Grant says:
  
  10 Jun10 June 12:33
  
  020 3564 6335
Shub says:

10 Jun10 June 12:39

Seeing lot of Virgin Atlantic Rewards availability in Upper class has opened up today which were not available till yesterday.
- WaynedP says:
  
  10 Jun10 June 12:55
  
  Thx @Shub, that’s useful.
  
  I’m booked JNB-LHR on 22 Jul but agent wasn’t able to upgrade me from Prem to UC. Upgraded outbound from LHR to JNB, but went away and scratched his head for a long time on the return, then told me not possible, I should keep checking online availability.
  But there seems to be something strange going on with VS return flights from JNB to LHR on 22, 23 & 25 July – still all blocked out, no fares available in any class for cash or points, even although it will allow me to select a seat on MMB.
  
  If it doesn’t resolve itself, I suspect I may be spending an extra night, or have to be re-routed on another airline. Gosh, how would that work if it’s KLM via AMS or FRA via CDG as I’ll be coming from a red country but mingling with amber pax ? Crazy.
  - Sam G says:
    
    10 Jun10 June 14:33
    
    sounds like a precursor to a cancellation
    
    fine to get rerouted. in fact until recently govt forced nearly all red list arrivals to route via amber countries by banning direct flights!
- Joe says:
  
  10 Jun10 June 13:05
  
  To where? Can’t see anything at all on the Caribbean routes.
  - Shub says:
    
    10 Jun10 June 13:16
    
    Sorry, should have mentioned. I was checking for Flights to India and it shows lot of availability now towards the end of the year (Not surprised given the current scenario there). Thought to share as there could be more availabilities on other routes as well.
    - Joe says:
      
      10 Jun10 June 14:37
      
      Thanks – can see plenty of options for India, US, Hong Kong – but nothing for Caribbean. Been waiting for months for them to drop a batch!
      - Memesweeper says:
        
        10 Jun10 June 17:40
        
        There’s never anything you want to the Caribbean on virgin
Navara says:

10 Jun10 June 13:10

Love the social distancing pods
https://www.oxpasturehallhotel.com/
- SteveJ says:
  
  10 Jun10 June 13:55
  
  Looks like it’d get hot in those!
  - Navara says:
    
    10 Jun10 June 14:37
    
    We get plenty of posters on here wanting a hot holiday abroad so there should be plenty of interest
- Super Secret Stuff says:
  
  10 Jun10 June 15:57
  
  They have them at a country pub near me, not personally used them, but good reviews so far!
  - David D says:
    
    10 Jun10 June 19:20
    
    Had breakfast in one at Old Meldrum House back in September 2020. Plenty of space, and really good to sit “outside” watching the scenery.
KevMc says:

10 Jun10 June 13:50

Anyone else had any issues booking a RFS with a 2-4-1 from an FTV?

I have just been on the phone to BA who told me I could only book LHR – PMI for 24,000 Avios + £2. Told her that isn’t correct and it should be 15,500 + £70, to which she said it wasn’t possible. Told her I am logged on to the website (using another voucher) and it has priced up correctly.

Is this operator incompetence, or can they no longer book at the ‘proper’ rate for RFS over the phone?
- Anna says:
  
  10 Jun10 June 14:40
  
  It sounds like she hasn’t clicked through to the payment options page, if their system is similar to the one we see. Should be bookable.
  - KevMc says:
    
    10 Jun10 June 15:56
    
    Yeah, I did say that to her.
    
    As it happens, I didn’t use the FTV voucher in the end, as it has been extended to April 2023, and I have two more which expire next May, so used one of them (I know 2-4-1 on RFS isn’t the best value, but we 4 vouchers, and we won’t be able to use them all for Long Haul routes before they expire as we are restricted to school hols)
- Genghis says:
  
  10 Jun10 June 15:09
  
  No problem for me last week. But more avios were taken than should have been so I had to call up again for a refund.
pauline says:

10 Jun10 June 14:12

I have a non cancellable booking (though lastminute.com) for the Heathrow Sofitel for mid August. I understand it is a quarantine hotel although I did not know at the time I booked and there was nothing on their site! Should I wait to nearer the time or try to cancel now – I assume lastminute.com is the only route?
- Chris Heyes says:
  
  10 Jun10 June 14:21
  
  pauline I have a booking for 13th Aug so I wouldn’t worry, well not yet ?
  things should be clearer by July
- Joe says:
  
  10 Jun10 June 14:38
  
  Your issue here is LM.com – they are absolutely hopeless.
- Anna says:
  
  10 Jun10 June 14:43
  
  Sofitel are pretty good at sorting out any queries, try emailing them direct. I had a (albeit booked directly) non-refundable booking for Easter last year when our trip was cancelled with 2 weeks’ notice due to the pandemic – they cancelled without penalty and no quibbles. Clearly if the hotel is being used for quarantine you should be able to cancel.
- Pauline says:
  
  10 Jun10 June 16:09
  
  Thanks everyone. I think I will email the hotel to check what their position is in the first instance – I think the moral is book direct and never non cancellation rate!
meta says:

10 Jun10 June 14:31

Anyone else having issues with points.com purchases not going through? Just tried to buy a few Marriott points to top up and also Aer Lingus Avios to extend the expiry and it’s throwing errors. Received notification on the phone that transaction processed. Tried both with Amex and Visa and same error.