The HfP chat thread – Monday 25th January

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• Chrism20 says:

  25 Jan25 January 09:52

  Morning everyone. Following the Jurys post yesterday I contacted them regarding points expiry during covid as normally it it 12 months and this was fast approaching for me. I have received the following reply this morning.

  “Thank you for your email.

  Normally we would expire points after 12 months of inactivity, but of course 2020 has very much been unexpected so currently there are no plans to expire points and I can’t confirm when this will resume at the moment. Rest assured however we will send out an email if and when points are due to expire to give our members ample time to use anything they’ve accumulated.”

  So no points expiry until further notice with Jurys.

• Paul says:

  25 Jan25 January 09:56

  The Amex Platinum £175 deal posted for me today after I bought £175 of John Lewis gifts cards and spent them within 15 minutes.

  • Rob says:

    25 Jan25 January 10:13

    In a Waitrose store presumably?

  • AD says:

    25 Jan25 January 12:54

    Posted for me yesterday, for JL gift card purchased in Waitrose 3 days earlier

    • G says:

      25 Jan25 January 15:42

      I went to what I thought was a Waitrose attached to a JL but my card says foodhall by JL. Going to give it a few days to get past pending and then see if I get the credit or not

      • David D says:

        25 Jan25 January 18:09

        Always check the T’s & C’s and if necessary check if the physical store comes up on the Waitrose website.

        • G says:

          25 Jan25 January 22:10

          It does actually show up on the Waitrose site as Waitrose Bluewater Foodhall but bills as John Lewis Bluewater Foodhall

• MT says:

  25 Jan25 January 09:59

  Quick question on the Virgin Atlantic Household Account. If I link someone to my Gold membership who has the Credit Card will the points they earn on the credit card transfer. I assume they will but the T&C’s are a bit vague stating
  “Rewards earned by Household Account Linked Members will not be transferred to the Gold Member’s account. Such Rewards include but are not limited to Rewards earned through the Virgin Atlantic Credit Card Account and Clubhouse invitations.”

  My assumption is these are just the vouchers etc, but points transfer, but want to check before they take a card out.

• RussellH says:

  25 Jan25 January 10:32

  Story in yesterday’s Sun Times consumer help column re VIrgin Atlantic Rewards+ card.
  Complainer took out card, £3000+ was charged to the card within the times limit to get the sign up bonus, but no bonus received.
  Turned out that he did not realise that the card fee of £160 did not count – obviously not an HfP reader! The spend was actually £21.25 short of £3000.
  Rather surprisingly, I thought, the ST took up the case and persuaded Virgin to pay up the points as a good will gesture.

  • Rob says:

    25 Jan25 January 10:37

    Not an unreasonable mistake to make, to be fair.

    • Louie says:

      25 Jan25 January 12:38

      I recently took out a new Amex here in Australia but didn’t want to trigger the bonus just yet only to receive it unexpectedly because they do include the card fee as qualifying spend, contrary to what I expected. You live and learn.

• kitten says:

  25 Jan25 January 10:34

  What do people on here think it will take for the UK govt to remove the requirement for PCR testing for anyone incoming.

  I’m looking forward to when risk groups are largely vaccinated, everyone’s back to work except for deep change in some industries (bars, restaurants, entertainment, anything requiring crowds etc).

  How long do you think the govt will keep the PCR test requirement as and when we get to that point?

  • Mco says:

    25 Jan25 January 10:47

    Looks like there will be compulsory 10 days in a hotel starting very soon. Most papers suggesting tomorrow. So the incoming PCR will probably be the last thing to go.

    • ChrisW says:

      25 Jan25 January 10:55

      If hotel quarantine is introduced for all current arrivals the Govt will need to find and manage more than 1 million empty hotel rooms. It is laughable to think they could organise a logistical exercise of this scale so quickly.

      Australia charges each hotel quarantine traveller almost £2,000 pp for the privilege. Who is going to be forking out that money?

      • Yuff says:

        25 Jan25 January 11:17

        Do you really think they’ll have to find a million rooms if they impose it, I don’t

      • Anna says:

        25 Jan25 January 11:33

        I agree; this is the UK so they will completely fail to consider the resources required to implement this – there’s no spare capacity for enforcement within any agency at the moment, and the 2012 Olympics showed how badly thought out using a private company like G4S can turn out to be!
        Additionally there will be people who simply refuse to go to a hotel and what then happens, are they just going to be arrested, effectively imprisoned for 10 days then taken to court to get the money out of them? I can see legal challenges left right and centre to anything like this, and with the courts currently backlogged as has never been seen before.
        I’m sure there will also be lawyers queuing up to represent people who may very well claim that they should not be forced to pay for a hotel when they have a perfectly good home in which to quarantine.
        It’s pointless making comparisons with Australia as they are not subject to the ECHR, which governs many of these freedoms.

        • The Savage Squirrel says:

          25 Jan25 January 13:28

          Actually Anna, it’s even specified on 5.1.e of the ECHR that detention for the prevention of spread of infectious disease is lawful, and the Court has backed this up on numerous occasions.
          The ECHR is used as a pre-emptive excuse for not doing something (generally because it’s difficult or expensive) far far more often than it truly prevents anything. If it were removed, another excuse would always be found…

        • Anna says:

          25 Jan25 January 14:11

          Savage Squirrel, I would imagine that would only apply to someone who is proven to be infected with a contagious disease, like when you see images of people with, e.g., Ebola being whisked away by BNC-suited types, or at least exhibiting symptoms associated with such a disease (so giving reasonable suspicion to believe they might be carrying it.)
          However, I would be most interested to see a case of someone being forcibly detained when they had not tested positive for a disease and also weren’t displaying any symptoms so please post!

        • Anna says:

          25 Jan25 January 14:12

          Or weren’t proven to have been in contact with someone who fitted either of the above criteria.

        • Anna says:

          25 Jan25 January 14:15

          In fact from the case of Enhorn v Sweden:

          “Such cases made clear that for detention to comply with principles of proportionality and freedom from arbitrariness, ***it must be established that the detained person is suffering from an infectious disease***, that the spread of disease is dangerous to public safety and that the detention of the infected person is the last resort measure in order to prevent disease spread.”

        • The Savage Squirrel says:

          25 Jan25 January 20:32

          Thanks for completely proving my point.
          The quote you give is NOT from the text of Enhorn even though you wrongly represent it it as such by saying it’s “from the case of Enhorn vs Sweden”.
          Enhorn didn’t in fact consider at all the question of whether uncertain diagnosis or mere risk of being infectious was sufficient (as there was no dispute about the appelant’s HIV status). Given that context, Martin’s opinion peice you quote (I googled the quote) is referring to the powers granted not extending to diseases which are non-infectious.
          That’s why it’s dangerous to rely on or quote 2ry opinion out of context, and it leaves you arguing that the text of Enhorn provides a definitive precedent on a question that it did not even consider, which just makes you look silly.
          It’s pretty well established that “infectious” includes being at reasonable risk of infectiousness – both the ECHR and the WHO’s International Health Regulations use this approach, as does a large ream of case law at national level. It’s not even a particularly contentious concept as few diagnoses in medicine are beyond doubt.

      • Mr(s) Entitled says:

        25 Jan25 January 12:02

        If it is implemented I would expect a sharp drop in passenger numbers making it more feasible.

        Basically, do enough to deter people and solve the problem at source. Two week quarantine at an inflated cost in a small room with no outside space, to be paid in advance with insufficient food and drink should do it.

        • ChrisW says:

          25 Jan25 January 13:00

          It will definitely deter people from travelling, I just don’t think the government realise the logistical challenges of setting this up quickly.

  • Tracey says:

    25 Jan25 January 10:47

    Do you mean change to a rapid flow test or abandon testing altogether?
    Personally I don’t think it will be any time soon, people are generally happier to get on a plane knowing everyone else has been tested.

  • Oli says:

    25 Jan25 January 10:49

    Not before October 2021 when everyone is vaccinated. But then it’s winter so more cases. I’d say summer 2022

• John says:

  25 Jan25 January 10:50

  “Fifty-nine laboratory-confirmed cases of Covid-19 from six of the eight different [Irish] health regions were linked to just one international flight into Ireland last summer – and the plane was just 17% full and some passengers wore masks.”

  https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40213163.html

  • Super Secret Stuff says:

    25 Jan25 January 11:00

    Surely this is not a surprise to anyone? Enclosed space, lots of frequently touched surfaces, recycled air etc.

    There is enough examples out there to put anyone off of flying right now

    • kitten says:

      25 Jan25 January 11:14

      And yet airlines keep telling us about hepa filters being as good as im hospitals and air completely cleaned every 3 minutes?

      Worrying

      • Super Secret Stuff says:

        25 Jan25 January 11:17

        A cash strapped business fighting for survival, wouldn’t you push the truth as far as possible and get clever with your messaging?

        You can’t get away from the fact you are in a confined space with potentially, hundreds of people for hours on end. All it takes is one droplet and you’ve got it

        • Rhys says:

          25 Jan25 January 11:30

          Fresh cabin air is a reality, not ‘being clever with your messaging’!

        • Super Secret Stuff says:

          25 Jan25 January 14:34

          Rhys, it is a reality, I agree. By being clever with your messaging, I mean: Don’t remind people your trapped in a tin tube for hours on end with hundreds of people who will barely follow the fasten seat belt and seat in the upright position rules, let alone wear a mask properly

  • Mco says:

    25 Jan25 January 11:03

    “The transport secretary, Grant Shapps, revealed earlier this month that only one in 1,000 of the coronavirus cases in England in December was brought in from abroad – and that was a month with plenty of people travelling, including 1.1 million through Heathrow.
    Today the figure is likely to be far lower, due to the diminishing number of arrivals to the UK.”

    • Super Secret Stuff says:

      25 Jan25 January 11:15

      That is directly bought in from abroad, not the overall effect of new lines of transmission

      They are just trying to hide there mistakes. After all, we did import the virus and it is spreading like wildfire. So clearly new cases from abroad do cause an issue!

      • TGLoyalty says:

        25 Jan25 January 12:46

        It’s funny people say this stuff still when the most contagious strain in mass circulation in the UK is from Kent.

        Yes the virus came from abroad originally but it’s circulating in the population in droves in the UK.

        Are we to live in fear from all mutations forever? Because this will continue to mutate forever!

        • Jamie says:

          25 Jan25 January 12:59

          You could ask the same rhetorical question about your posts at times.

        • ashish says:

          25 Jan25 January 13:49

          LOL

        • Charlieface says:

          25 Jan25 January 14:36

          Truth is they don’t know it’s from Kent. it could just as easily have been someone who brought it in from France or Belgium, where they don’t check for variants as much

        • Super Secret Stuff says:

          25 Jan25 January 14:38

          @TG it came from China and took hold firmly. The fact that it had the time to mutate is testament to how well it spread from imported cases

          The system is flawed as is, but they cant admit it. Because then they’ll admit they’ve made a massive mistake all along

        • TGLoyalty says:

          25 Jan25 January 16:18

          actually the tracing says the vast majority of cases were strains from Spain and Italy .. as it had already started to mutate.

          China will say it also came from there too …

          While it can’t be proven with complete certainty the overwhelming view is that Patient zero is from Kent, or doesn’t that support your argument?

          “The World Health Organisation has since confirmed the first sample was discovered in Kent on September 20.

          Data from the COVID-19 Genomics UK Consortium shows a key sample was found in a location “near Canterbury”.”

        • Super Secret Stuff says:

          25 Jan25 January 18:21

          @TG even if it came from Spain or anywhere else abroad it was still imported and I would class any resultant infections as imported.

          The point is lack border controls is what let’s it in and take control

    • Jonathan says:

      25 Jan25 January 19:18

      Ha ha. That’s going off data collected from contact tracing. Considering the response rate for that is laughably low & the majority of people didn’t fully comply with the isolation period after a foreign trip so wouldn’t own up to having been abroad it’s a massive underestimate.

      The PLF data isn’t linked to PCR results so no way of obtaining good data in this area.

• Ant says:

  25 Jan25 January 10:56

  Morning, can someone pls remind me. Can I use Bendy with Virgin to deposit in ERNIE? Thanks

  • Sean says:

    25 Jan25 January 11:09

    yes

• Tony says:

  25 Jan25 January 11:15

  Quick question on the recent Amex PayPal offer. I sent £70 to a relative and received the email from Amex saying that the offer had been triggered, but haven’t seen the credit yet after 10 days. Has anyone received the credit via sending money to a friend/relative?

  • Anna says:

    25 Jan25 January 11:37

    I used my credit towards buying wine and it appeared within a couple of days.

  • dave says:

    25 Jan25 January 12:58

    I used the deal on my card on the 8th Jan ( i think) to send £70 to my wife and used her supplementary card to send £70 to my paypal account. Both of us got emails confirming the offer was triggered. The £15 credit hit my account after two days. Still no sign of the one from my wife’s! Amex have told me it is valid but it might take up to 90 days…

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