The new HFP chat thread – Friday 8th May

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• BJ says:

  8 May8 May 07:49

  Morning all. What are readers doing with standalone hotel reservations made at BA dot com and paid with cash? It is an Accor hotel stsy in June and nonrefundable. The flight I was planning to use in conjunction with this hotel reservation has been cancelled by BA and I already got a refund on that. Can I ask BA Refund Helper at FT to process this cancellation or do I need to call BA Holidays? What are peoples experience with BA Holidays on standalone hotel reservations; are they sticking to the non refundable terms, rebooking, or offering vouchers or cash refunds? Thanks in advance if I do not get a chance to come back online before this evening.

  • BrightonReader says:

    8 May8 May 07:58

    He can’t help with BA holiday bookings.

  • Harry T says:

    8 May8 May 13:30

    @BJ
    Unfortunately, I don’t have any relevant experience. BA Refund Helper is only assisting with flights, I believe. I have heard the BA Holidays team are excellent if you call them. I would suggest asking on Flyertalk too, as I’ve seen people asking similar questions.

    • Lyn says:

      8 May8 May 18:10

      From yesterday’s comments it sounds as BA Refund Helper is also doing this in their own spare time! So contacting them should be a last resort after other avenues have failed or refunds have taken way too long.

• Yuff says:

  8 May8 May 08:09

  Looks like someone is mucking around with replies apparently I have responded to some replies to my original question 8.01……hmmmmm

• Richard says:

  8 May8 May 08:19

  REDEMPTION OF IHG POINTS

  Hi all, quick question. I have a number of IHG® points which I am looking to redeem. However, when trying to book, redemption only seems possible on the most basic rooms in any hotel. Does anyone have any advice as to how you can redeem IHG points for higher class rooms or even club Intercontinental rooms? I have tried a large number of hotels just to test this out and I can’t seem to find a way. Any help is appreciated.

  • IHG sucks says:

    8 May8 May 08:22

    You can’t. Only redemptions in basic rooms (unless the hotel makes better rooms available to redeem at the regular rate, it does happen but is usually a mistake).

    Hilton is better in this regard, any room can be booked with points.

    • Richard says:

      8 May8 May 08:35

      Oh well that is a real blow if that is the case. And I don’t really understand why that would be the case. In that case, does anyone know if there are upgrade options available if you do book the most basic room to allow, for example, an upgrade to a club room with payment? Was thinking of buying some extra points with the current offer, but it doesn’t really seem worth it if the restrictions are as discussed above.

      • Davios says:

        8 May8 May 08:40

        Do you have status? I’ve had luck sweet talking upgrades. If it’s an InterContinental then Ambassador status will get you an upgrade (I don’t think it’s guaranteed with points bookings but I’ve always got an upgrade at IC without asking). IC properties also normally offer paid upgrades to club at check-in if you ask (but see what they’re willing to give you for free first)

        • Davios says:

          8 May8 May 08:47

          Forgot to say that Ambassador is a paid for status that anyone can get, you don’t have to earn it. Ambassador benefits are at IC hotels only but also gives you Platinum in IHG if you don’t have it already. The benefits are very good.

        • BrightonReader says:

          8 May8 May 08:48

          I had a 2 night redemption and a 5 night cash stay booked at an I.C. and they put my redemption night room in the same upgraded category as the cash room (I have Amb)

          Hoping they do the same as I cancelled and rebooked as the rates came down!

      • Andrew (@andrewseftel) says:

        8 May8 May 08:40

        Some IHG hotels offer the standby Nor1 upgrades on points bookings. Alternatively it’s worth contacting the hotel directly and asking for a quote. Often they will just charge the difference in rate between room categories.

  • Peter K says:

    8 May8 May 08:55

    A potential option is to use your points to buy an IHG $ gift card to use at hotels via their website. You get about 0.3p value per point doing that however, so not worth buying points for. It allows more flexibility in room choice though as you can book a pay at hotel rate and use the card to pay.

    • Genghis says:

      8 May8 May 11:00

      Do you earn points back on these gift card bookings? I presume so. If so, it changes the earn rate somewhat, especially when combined with promos, perhaps taking it up to my 0.4p benchmark. I’ve not really thought about it much.

      • Rob says:

        8 May8 May 11:14

        Yes, because it is just like paying with a credit card. Only issue is that, looking the FT thread on these, they are often rejected. There are FX fees too if you’re not paying in $.

  • Chrisasaurus says:

    8 May8 May 09:02

    Hi Richard,

    Welcome to the game

    Afraid IHG is, in almost all cases a basic redemption only. No perks, no breakfast and no premium rooms.

    Points are very easy to come by, as is status which is essentially the problem; neither have as much value as they do in other programs.

    Don’t buy points without a specific redemption in mind. My points balance has grown year on year for over a decade, because of the limitations I cannot burn as fast as I earn and that’s despite our company preferring Marriott where possible

    • Richard says:

      8 May8 May 13:33

      Thank you everyone, I appreciate everyone’s input into this. Yes I have the highest status and Ambassador and that is what I think I was surprised about the lack of points spending ability. Anyway I’ve learnt a lot today and I know that I shouldn’t be buying points unless I’ve got a redemption in mind and even then, where there is availability. Set me back in my understanding as Hilton do offer points redemptions against all classes of rooms so just was a little surprised. Thanks everyone.

      • Lyn says:

        8 May8 May 18:20

        With Spire and Ambassador you are likely to be upgraded anyway, even at non-IC hotels. But as others have said it is always asking the individual hotel about possibilities. Some IC hotels offer Club lounge access for a daily amount, with a discount for Spire members.

        • Lady London says:

          8 May8 May 21:56

          I believe CP of the various IHG brands, is the most reliable for upgrading/potentially giving Club access to Ambs.

          Also daft I know but make sure hotel does have a Club lounge and it’s open if that’s what you’re looking for, before choosing

• Nick_C says:

  8 May8 May 08:22

  As u drie maande van die jaar in die Verenigde Koninkryk werk, kan u miskien in Engels pos?

  • davvero says:

    8 May8 May 18:13

    Waaroor gaan hierdie boodskap?

• Titus Adduxas says:

  8 May8 May 08:27

  I’ve had my Avios flights to Toronto officially cancelled now, but was unable to use the refund workaround as we live in Newcastle and had to make a change to the booking to enable the last leg to be added.

  Obviously on line I can get the voucher but with the excessive waiting times on the phone I’m wondering what would happen if I did nothing at all! Could they impose a voucher on me or are they obliged to refund everything. Has anyone done this, or know what happens? The 241 they were booked under technically runs out in August I believe.

  • BA fan says:

    8 May8 May 08:32

    If you take a voucher then the voucher will take your points and 2 for 1 and keep them valid until 2022.

    If you want a cash refund then you need to consider what’s best to do. For me if I call at odd hours then I tend to get through relatively quickly (if you get cut off call in again).

    There’s a refund helper on the amazing flyertalk forums who can process this for you, however he’s bogged down and doesn’t want people to use this channel until they’ve explored other options. If you really don’t want to call perhaps try contacting them via the webform in the contact us section. Make it clear you want a refund and not a voucher.

    • BrightonReader says:

      8 May8 May 08:43

      Keep trying the phone.

      Call volumes – hence wait times – are nowhere near as bad as they were,

      If you want a refund the sooner you call the sooner It will be processed.

      • E says:

        8 May8 May 09:01

        I called earlier this week on Monday afternoon (can’t remember what time) and only waited 5 minutes. I got cut off the first time though. But I would keep trying on the phone as it wasn’t long to wait this week and I’ve had the money back already.

    • Titus Adduxas says:

      8 May8 May 09:04

      I’m not desperate for the money and don’t believe BA will go under. If you’re telling me that the voucher will also be extended for 2 years that would be by far the best option for me. Can anyone confirm the voucher extension as I was under the impression it was only 6 months.

      • Rob says:

        8 May8 May 09:48

        6 months if you have the voucher put back into your BA account. April 2022 if you refund the entire flight as a ‘Book with Confidence’ voucher (neither the cash, Avios or 241 are returned to your respective accounts in this case).

    • Steve M says:

      8 May8 May 09:07

      Are you 100% the 241 gets rolled up into the refund voucher?
      Had Toronto CW flights refunded but 241 was due to expire this June but extended to Dec’20.

      • BA fan says:

        8 May8 May 09:11

        Definitely sure. Everyone’s 2 for 1 got extended 6 months but if you have a booking and then choose to take the voucher then everything gets encapsulated in the vouchers (cash, Avios, and vouchers including 2 for 1 and gold upgrades) and is valid until the vouchers expiry in 2022. If you need further confirmation check flyertalk

      • Rob says:

        8 May8 May 09:48

        Yes, it is rolled into voucher and valid until April 2022.

  • Craig says:

    8 May8 May 08:39

    My daughter was in a similar position, here Canada flight was cancelled a couple of days ago and she has received a full refund! To be honest I was flabbergasted by how quickly the refund appeared.

    • Craig says:

      8 May8 May 08:39

      Forgot to add hers was not an Avios redemption.

  • Anna says:

    8 May8 May 08:44

    The refund workaround appears to be completely defunct anyway now if that’s any consolation!

  • Alan Begg says:

    8 May8 May 09:06

    My Avios and 2-4-1 booking to NY was cancelled on Monday. I called mid afternoon, got through in around 15 minutes, had the points and voucher back within 10 minutes and the money back on My Amex by Tuesday night

    • Optimus Prime says:

      8 May8 May 11:31

      What’s the phone number to request a refund? Is it 0800 727 800? Every time I called yesterday I was immediately asked to hang up and try again later because they were too busy. Which they wouldn’t be if they hadn’t blocked online cash refunds…

  • Andrew-A says:

    8 May8 May 11:29

    I called BA last Sunday and only waited around 10 mins to cancel 2 x flights, both with Avios and one with a 2 for 1. When you call just ignore the message that asks you to call back if you have waited less than 30 days and keep holding. The guy was really helpful, all avios and voucher returned within an hour, money will take 6 weeks apparently but it was only £200 so no big deal.

• Ben says:

  8 May8 May 08:49

  My Virgin Atlantic card just renewed at the £160 fee. They’re refusing the refund it as I decided to cancel it when I noticed given the situation.

  Might be worth others to take note. Virgin money are not very helpful or understanding by any means right now.

  • davvero says:

    8 May8 May 08:56

    Criticism of Virgin is not allowed on this site (big sponsors) and might get deleted

    • TGLoyalty says:

      8 May8 May 09:21

      Bore off. Baseless claims aren’t, substantiated criticism is.

      • davvero says:

        8 May8 May 09:26

        Really?

        • Rhys says:

          8 May8 May 09:33

          Yes, really.

        • TGLoyalty says:

          8 May8 May 09:33

          Even worse if you don’t have the back bone to post the criticism under your normal pseudonym and have resort to calling yourself Boris etc instead or even worse imitate others.

    • Rob says:

      8 May8 May 09:50

      About 10% of our revenue comes from Virgin, of which 80% is technically from Virgin Money. The airline itself pays us peanuts (Amazon paid us almost as much last month alone than Virgin Atlantic paid us in the whole of 2019).

      • davvero says:

        8 May8 May 09:57

        10% of revenue is still a significant partner. They also invite you to their events so presumably don’t want the boat rocked

        • Rob says:

          8 May8 May 09:59

          I personally don’t care. I’ve got two little kids and three staff to manage – I genuinely dislike leaving the country for more than 24 hours unless I am in total control of my time, which you’re not on press trips where every minute is blocked out, and have never been on a Virgin press flight.

          The no-kids youngsters are happy to go, of course, but even that is a bit of a drag as I lose someone for 3-4 days and we get one article out of it.

          One of the joys of the current situation is that it is like HFP was five years ago – no advertiser meetings, no airline meetings, no marketing campaigns to quote for etc. We can just write stuff.

        • J says:

          8 May8 May 10:17

          Brands/PRs do not typically blacklist critical journalists – the Daily Mail write all sorts of negative stories about BA and Virgin but neither could afford to ignore them.

        • Brian W says:

          8 May8 May 11:10

          It’s Rob’s train set @davvero, get over it. I’d suggest you move on and read one of the many other blogs if you don’t believe HFP is transparent enough for you.

    • Chrish says:

      8 May8 May 11:10

      davvera, Not at all true, As long as its reasonable criticism it is fine (maybe even encouraged lol)
      After all there are loads on here who whenever anything negative is said about Virgin will start jumping up and down in Virgin’s defense
      which drives more comments (which keeps this blog brilliant)
      People are on here for various reasons (which I’m sure Rob as come to realize over the years)
      Some to get Good Articles (which are mostly provided otherwise this blog would have long departed)
      Others to get Advice from NOT ONLY Rob but others on here
      Some like “ME” who are on here for above when appropriate, but also to have a laugh at all the people on here giving stupid comments (yes its entertainment as well)

  • MattB says:

    8 May8 May 08:58

    Was the fee charged at the anniversary date or prior?

  • Peter K says:

    8 May8 May 08:58

    Agreed that Virgin Money CS do seem awful at the moment.
    If you’ve not gone into year 2 however, I’d ask them for written confirmation that that is their final answer and then take them to Money Claim Online for the fee. I’m sure you’d win the case in such a situation.

    • Chris says:

      8 May8 May 09:40

      Couldn’t agree more re Virgin Money Customer Service. Whilst I don’t have the VM credit card my current account is/was with Clydesdale Bank which is currently being rolled into and rebranded as Virgin Money. The service at times since the changeover has been woeful. I’m at the point that I really should spend some of time I have indoors looking at alternative accounts.

      • Novice says:

        8 May8 May 15:40

        I must admit VM have been nothing but awesome to me. I had a fixed rate account maturing 2023 or maybe 2024 and I webchat with them asking to close the account without fees/penalties as I thought I better invest instead and they agreed and transferred the money to another account and closed the account without any penalty.

        I did remind them other banks were doing the same but they didn’t argue about it and promptly resolved my request.

        • Novice says:

          8 May8 May 15:42

          Of course in my request I did convey that I am struggling to live as I have no money 😂

  • BA fan says:

    8 May8 May 09:19

    You don’t get this issue with BA. The BA card is issued by Amex that offer pro-rated refunds rather than a cowboy outfit like the Bank of Beardy.

    The only cards you need are the BA Amex and a Tesco Mastercard as a backup

    • J says:

      8 May8 May 10:00

      Depends what your situation is. I don’t need Avios or Virgin miles so Marriott/Hilton are my preferred cards. As for Avios vs Virgin depends on your situation. My regular leisure redemption is to South Africa, Virgin Premium Economy or Upper beats the equivalent BA classes hands down every time in my opinion, so I value my Virgin points more. If you want to go to Japan, ANA (a Virgin redemption) I’ve no doubt is a better experience than BA/Virgin and less Avios than redeeming on JAL. This is all assuming Virgin keep flying and I’m confident they will.

    • Ming the Merciless says:

      8 May8 May 10:24

      Interesting. I would suggest the following are the only cards you need:

      Amex plat- day to day spend. Useful for the 90k referral and churn with amex business plat. About £2k a month

      Curve- 500k limit
      Ihg – I Use premium but a more cost effective solution would be white – 50k per month
      Virgin- I use the free card as I was given a 25k limit. Paid card only had a £4K limit so want productive. 25k per month

      I hold LLoyds Avios card but haven’t used it since they stopped the balance transfer benefits

      And finally the tesco debit card which I have a very fond spot for. I think it’s the sturdy plastic feel in the wallet and high quality graphics.

      Hilton Barclay card would have been nice I think but I missed it.

  • BA fan says:

    8 May8 May 09:22

    Advice for the future is stick to cards issued with reputable banks. The only one I trust with an annual fee is Amex as they offer pro-rated refunds.
    So the only cards I need are the BA Amex – the expensive one so I get a 2 for 1
    Tesco Mastercard for the small number of places Amex isn’t accepted (it’s accepted in a lot more places these days)

    • Andrew says:

      8 May8 May 10:18

      Clydesdale have been around for a bit longer than Amex, and are one of the few retail banks in the world who have a licence to print money.

      There’s nothing to stop them putting beardie on their bank notes.

      Their customer service has always been a bit “Glasgow” though and never really recovered from Fred’s influence in the 1990s.

      Just put in a complaint and then escalate to FOS if you have to. Customers shouldn’t suffer as a consequence of market disruption.

  • jamie says:

    8 May8 May 09:49

    Sorry – if you didn’t cancel it in time then that’s you problem right?

    • MattB says:

      8 May8 May 10:25

      Some people have been the charged the fee for yr 2 after only 11 months of yr 1

      • Peter K says:

        8 May8 May 13:05

        Got an email after 10 months to say I’ll be charged next year’s fee on the statement at 11 months.

        If you only want to keep the card for one year but you’re charged a non-refundable fee after 11 months, then either you’re losing a month that is owed you, or the original fee was not an *annual* fee but 11 monthly one!

        • Harry T says:

          8 May8 May 14:46

          I got the same email, Peter K! Bizarre that they are so brazen about charging you a month early… I’ve heard of a few people getting caught out, which is why I was keen to cancel promptly.

      • Fraser says:

        8 May8 May 17:41

        I took out the paid card in June 2018, and the annual fee was charged on the last day of the first month’s statement, 11th July. The 2019 renewal fee was on 11th June, which makes me think it’s charged on the date the application was approved, but delayed until the last day of the first statement.

        It certainly wasn’t charged after 11 months from when I was approved for the card, maybe 11 months from when it was first charged though. To their credit they emailed a reminder about the fee more than a month before it will be charged, so plenty of notice to cancel.

        I won’t keep the paid card next year, I already have two vouchers plus a PE upgrade flight to reschedule from this month so will build up Amex points instead for now and look at a BA 2-for-1 card next.

        Interestingly I got a lengthy survey from the Virgin Red “Town Hall” proposing a revamp of loyalty earning and burning across Virgin businesses and partners – seems the wrong time to be asking what I’d like to change, when my main concern is to not lose the substantial stash of points I already have!

  • jimA says:

    8 May8 May 11:46

    That isn’t new,, Virgin CS has always been pretty poor, its one of the reasons I cancelled 6 months ago when my year was up. They charged me 2 weeks before the end and only refunded when I pointed out that I had already asked them the date I would be charged. They had told me it would be 13 days later than the date they imposed the charge. Even then it took 3 weeks to get the chrge refunded and the card cancelled

  • Harry T says:

    8 May8 May 13:36

    Just cancelled my Virgin Rewards + due to the uncertainty around the continued survival of VS, and their unfortunately low credit limits (initially given 1.5k, increased to 2.5k, not given an increase this time without a review). Amex is happy to give me five figure credit limits but Virgin have an odd system that seems aimed at restricting the spend of high spenders/earners (this wasn’t such an issue before they stopping you being to recycle your credit limit and receive points).

    I would happily apply again in six months for a VS card, if they are still around. The customer service has been good the two times I’ve rang over the last two days – not Amex good but helpful and pleasant.

    • Mike says:

      8 May8 May 14:44

      Strange on the credit limit. Virgin just offered me a bump from 20 to 25k without me asking, on the paid card. I was using (and paying off every month) most of the credit limit I had for a few months before all this kicked off though…

  • Jonathan says:

    8 May8 May 13:47

    Absolutely correct . I rang up a few days ago to cancel my card and ask for a pro rata refund for the annual fee of £160 . I was told unequivocally NO . I asked to speak to a supervisor and was told he was too busy and would call me back within 24 hours . That was 4 days ago and still heard nothing. I’ve cancelled the card anyway as I’ve already bailed out of flying club in IHG and Hilton .

    • Secret Squirrel says:

      8 May8 May 14:03

      You can’t get a pro rata refund on the Virgin paid card, states it in the terms. The only was is from the free card upgrading using boost to paid card, that is in the terms.

• GoatHerder says:

  8 May8 May 09:33

  It lasted a while but when the good people of Christmas Island (they own .cx as it’s their country code) discovered what the domain was being used for it was shut down. There’s now a mirror of the site in Russia if you miss it – see http://goatse.ru/ for more information

• Andrew says:

  8 May8 May 10:41

  Yikes, the Google ads are getting worse.

  “Camouflage Knife Set”

  Does Google sense check any ads before they publish them?

  • Kai says:

    8 May8 May 10:46

    It’s based on your profile and browsing history

  • Rob says:

    8 May8 May 11:00

    No, basically. Strangely, despite being able to build a search system which is so smart it now searches based on what you meant rather than what you typed (this is true, look it up) and can search 1 trillion web pages in a fraction of a second, it is incapable of stopping bad ads.

    For example, as you know Martin Lewis has been running a major campaign against fake ads featuring him. How hard is it for any ad featuring the word ‘Martin’ to be sent for manual approval?

    You may also question why, when we manually block an ad, it takes literally hours for that block to kick in.

    • Anuj says:

      9 May9 May 01:39

      I also find it appalling there’s no report button on most ads. The regulations are sorely lacking in this area.

  • Secret Squirrel says:

    8 May8 May 19:34

    It must be by IP address also as I keep getting woman’s clothes adverts (or was that me after 10pm)??😄

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